Pintail wrasse swimmbladder issues

[JoannaLola]

I have literally only metroplex, methylene blue, epsom salt, prazi and copper I don’t think any of those will work unless he have huge worms in that huge belly than prazi...
Vet wants 500$ for needle decompression and xray... XRay??? On a fish??? So what you guys think?? Dead sentence?
I try feed him, sometimes he takes Pe mysis with selcon and spits out

 

[ngoodermuth]

I would try the epsom salt first, since it has basically zero risk... and then proceed from there. The next least-invasive thing you could try would be the MB bath in a 5g bucket.

Methylene Blue
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sh...p?threads/Methylene-Blue.257467/&share_type=t

 

[JoannaLola]

I don’t have tap talk...sorry How do you think methylene blue would help him in this case? Also I never ever bath a fish in epsom salt! Any advice? Instructions? Other than bucket and heater and RO? Or I need to make freash saltwater and match ph?
Thank you!

 

[ngoodermuth]

The epsom salt (make sure it’s plain, pharmaceutical grade with no additives) can be dosed right in your tank. No bath needed. Might raise the magnesium level a bit, but reef safe. 1 tablespoon epsom salt per 5 gallons water.

The bath I was suggesting would be with methylene blue. For that you would match salinity (so yes, fresh saltwater) and temperature in a separate container. Also, you would want an airline for O2. 30 minute bath with 1 teaspoon MB per 5 gallons water.

 

[eatbreakfast]

There is a detailed video and thread on R2R about venting or needling a swim bladder. I want to sayit was about 4yrs ago and the username had bmw in it.

 

[ngoodermuth]

There is a detailed video and thread on R2R about venting or needling a swim bladder. I want to sayit was about 4yrs ago and the username had bmw in it.

That link is in this post... along with a lot of other good bits of advice.

Venting a swim bladder
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sh...s/Venting-a-swim-bladder.335275/&share_type=t

 

[JoannaLola]

@eatbreakfast @ngoodermuth Thank you!! I read everything already! I also did Epsom Salt and tomorrow I will do Methylene Blue dip... Than I need to do operation ;Nurse I love to buy MS222, but it will come in a week and I don’t think I have time as he is not eating.. Im dipping mysis in selcon in front of him so min the selcon is getting to him...
Now the most important question is should I do and risk his fast dead or wait...and have hope...

 

[eatbreakfast]

If it hasn't improved after the epsom salt and MB bath, then I would definitely proceed with venting.

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

@eatbreakfast @ngoodermuth Thank you!! I read everything already! I also did Epsom Salt and tomorrow I will do Methylene Blue dip... Than I need to do operation ;Nurse I love to buy MS222, but it will come in a week and I don’t think I have time as he is not eating.. Im dipping mysis in selcon in front of him so min the selcon is getting to him...
Now the most important question is should I do and risk his fast dead or wait...and have hope...

If it’s been this long I would try the venting, if he’s not eating then death is inevitable. Good luck!

 

[JoannaLola]

@eatbreakfast @Frtdrmrose7
I will try venting today. I have no idea what I’m going to do as I never even hold a fish in hand to take a pic...
I post video below and he looks like a goner, but he is still very strong I think to be alive...
His belly grow even more( No food for days now...
Wish me luck or pray please.
Also should I just poke or sucked the air and to be honest I will poke the biggest, swollen spot and try not to injure other organs. Even if the air come out, he may die from infection after, as I cannot bring him to quarantine as I have Purple Tang there with copper...

 

[JoannaLola]

 

[ngoodermuth]

He looks very weak, but its worth a try... Good luck

 

[RMS18]

Hey sorry for the late reply. I may have missed some of these questions. Before we go sticking this fish I'd like a few questions answered. Sticking a fish especially a Wrasse is no walk in the park.

How long have you had the fish?
How long has he been like this?
Do you have a QT setup and ready for this fish? - he will need this as secondary bacterial infections are a high risk. Also lower flow while healing from the the pinning is helpful to reduce stress.

We can talk offline about the procedureif you need. If you need I can also mail you the syringe if you do not have access to one. You want to keep the gauge 29-30.

 

[JoannaLola]

Hey sorry for the late reply. I may have missed some of these questions. Before we go sticking this fish I'd like a few questions answered. Sticking a fish especially a Wrasse is no walk in the park.

How long have you had the fish?
How long has he been like this?
Do you have a QT setup and ready for this fish? - he will need this as secondary bacterial infections are a high risk. Also lower flow while healing from the the pinning is helpful to reduce stress.

We can talk offline about the procedureif you need. If you need I can also mail you the syringe if you do not have access to one. You want to keep the gauge 29-30.

Im doing it the “operation” in 2 h. I went to my dentist lol and got tiny 27 and 30 needles... Looks like 30 is on the smaller side but the 27 is longer... Also got Sodium Chloride Irrigation, USP 0.9% ( perfect for cleaning wounds, body cavities, infections and for surgical procedures... The only problem now is I don’t know where his bladder is(( I may kill him... He is still strong, trying to swimm;((
I have him time 1 month, he is like that approximately 1,5 week

 

[jabberwock]

Check this out: http://www.reefedition.com/emergency-fish-operation-venting-swim-bladder/

 

[RMS18]

Im doing it the “operation” in 2 h. I went to my dentist lol and got tiny 27 and 30 needles... Looks like 30 is on the smaller side but the 27 is longer... Also got Sodium Chloride Irrigation, USP 0.9% ( perfect for cleaning wounds, body cavities, infections and for surgical procedures... The only problem now is I don’t know where his bladder is(( I may kill him... He is still strong, trying to swimm;((
I have him time 1 month, he is like that approximately 1,5 week

Look back at my article... Swim bladders are located under and in front the belly of the fish. If you use a bright light under the clear platform like I show in my video you will easily see the swim bladder. It will appear to be a clear chamber with nothing inside it. You will know when you break through into the bladder. The resistance will stop and the pin will slide easily. Use the 30 gauge. You do not need to travel far at all.

To give this fish the best chance of survival he should be in his own qt tank, clean water, no lights, PVC and low flow. I have done around 20 of these procedures myself. Watch my video few times if you have to and look at some pictures of a healthy pintail so you know what the swim bladder should look like, pull slowly on the plunger of the syringe when pulling air out. It will not vent on it's own, the syringe must have a plunger.

Good luck.

 

[JoannaLola]

Look back at my article... Swim bladders are located under and in front the belly of the fish. If you use a bright light under the clear platform like I show in my video you will easily see the swim bladder. It will appear to be a clear chamber with nothing inside it. You will know when you break through into the bladder. The resistance will stop and the pin will slide easily. Use the 30 gauge. You do not need to travel far at all.

To give this fish the best chance of survival he should be in his own qt tank, clean water, no lights, PVC and low flow. I have done around 20 of these procedures myself. Watch my video few times if you have to and look at some pictures of a healthy pintail so you know what the swim bladder should look like, pull slowly on the plunger of the syringe when pulling air out. It will not vent on it's own, the syringe must have a plunger.

Good luck.

Thank you so much!! I really appreciate your help!
I will try my best for sure!!!!

 

[JoannaLola]

Ok guys,
I did it. I don’t know how, but I did it...
The swimm bladder was so big that I really didn’t have much control as of how much air I should suck up... I lay the fish on a right side and sucked up a tiny bit, but the baloon deflated immediately... I rub Sodium Chloride before and after... Don’t know if it’s harmful for fish either but if it’s good for human wounds, its fine for small needel hole... He was fighting and jumping on the glass bawl and I scream few times
I put him back to the tank and he flow down to the sand breathing heavy... He didn’t fell sand in over a week so I was very happy seeing him down and even if he would have died at this moment, this would be a happy dead, but he didn’t! He start swimming after 10 min or so... He swim few times and now is resting on the sand.. Breathing but heavy. He may be dead in the morning, but I know I did everything in my power to safe him... He is not in quarantine tank as I only have 1 quarantine with copper and purple tang in it.
Now all I can do is wait... Tomorrow Im getting Maracyn 2 and Furan 2 in case of infection. I can’t buy any other antibiotics in Canada in fact any antibiotics over the counter are illegal time 2019

 

[RMS18]

Ok guys,
I did it. I don’t know how, but I did it...
The swimm bladder was so big that I really didn’t have much control as of how much air I should suck up... I lay the fish on a right side and sucked up a tiny bit, but the baloon deflated immediately... I rub Sodium Chloride before and after... Don’t know if it’s harmful for fish either but if it’s good for human wounds, its fine for small needel hole... He was fighting and jumping on the glass bawl and I scream few times
I put him back to the tank and he flow down to the sand breathing heavy... He didn’t fell sand in over a week so I was very happy seeing him down and even if he would have died at this moment, this would be a happy dead, but he didn’t! He start swimming after 10 min or so... He swim few times and now is resting on the sand.. Breathing but heavy. He may be dead in the morning, but I know I did everything in my power to safe him... He is not in quarantine tank as I only have 1 quarantine with copper and purple tang in it.
Now all I can do is wait... Tomorrow Im getting Maracyn 2 and Furan 2 in case of infection. I can’t buy any other antibiotics in Canada in fact any antibiotics over the counter are illegal time 2019

Nice job. Glad to hear he is still alive. If you hit any major organs he would not be alive for very long. I have never used sodium chloride, only iodine.

It is not uncommon for any fish after venting to be breathing heavy, especially a Wrasse.

Fingers crossed, you did all you can. Now we wait. Please keep us posted, wishing him the best.

 

[JoannaLola]

Here is the equipment I use...