QT and DT question

[Josett Waid]

And Josett? Please post those nitrite and nitrate test results when you can. Using that information we may be able to determine if the bio load from a trigger is just too high for that size tank/filter or if the bacteria aren't seeding the tank well.

My dad says they are probably pretty high since the tank is only 5days old and also being the fish it's pretty big for the tank. We do have a more established QT tank but it has copper in it and we didn't want to put him in that.. So since it is still only a week old we think we may have to let it sit and just do the water changes or also my dad said if we have to we can put a skimmer on it if that may help?

 

[Humblefish]

Have you double checked your ammonia reading using a different test kit? Just to be sure you aren't getting a false positive.

 

[Josett Waid]

Also if some copper is in the tank could that be throwing the test off? We put one dose of copper in the tank the first day but we've been pulling it out with every water change everyday..

 

[Josett Waid]

Have you double checked your ammonia reading using a different test kit? Just to be sure you aren't getting a false positive.

We only have the hang on safety alert and one test kit but it's brand new. So no we havent been able to check it with another one since we just bought the new one.

 

[Brew12]

My dad says they are probably pretty high since the tank is only 5days old and also being the fish it's pretty big for the tank. We do have a more established QT tank but it has copper in it and we didn't want to put him in that.. So since it is still only a week old we think we may have to let it sit and just do the water changes or also my dad said if we have to we can put a skimmer on it if that may help?

They should be high right now. If they are, that tells us the bio load from the fish is overwhelming the filtration system. If they are not high, that tells us there is a problem with the bacteria not working correctly.

Copper shouldn't impact the alert badge. Even fairly low levels will throw off your other test kits.

 

[Joey waid]

They should be high right now. If they are, that tells us the bio load from the fish is overwhelming the filtration system. If they are not high, that tells us there is a problem with the bacteria not working correctly.

Copper shouldn't impact the alert badge. Even fairly low levels will throw off your other test kits.

It's not the badge, it is on the first alert though. It's the API test kit that reading .5. The jist of this is I wanted to move him to a 4 week old fallow tank. I'm just going to keep changing water until the bacteria keeps up or the other tank is at 6 weeks.

 

[Brew12]

It's not the badge, it is on the first alert though. It's the API test kit that reading .5. The jist of this is I wanted to move him to a 4 week old fallow tank. I'm just going to keep changing water until the bacteria keeps up or the other tank is at 6 weeks.

Correct me if I am wrong (don't have it in front of me) but isn't the alert at .05ppm? I wouldn't worry about doing water changes unless the badge starts getting closer to the color of the Alarm, and then do at least a 50% change.

 

[Joey waid]

Your right. I don't know what to trust the badge or test kit?

 

[Joey waid]

It also takes a long time for the badge to reset.

 

[Joey waid]

I have always heard test kits do not read true if there is any copper in the system. This is the first time ever using copper and or a badge.

 

[Brew12]

Your right. I don't know what to trust the badge or test kit?

The badge. The test kits will give you a bad reading which is why using the badge is so important. Trust the badge and save yourself some work! Just do you water change before you get to the alert color and do a large change.

 

[Joey waid]

The badge. The test kits will give you a bad reading which is why using the badge is so important. Trust the badge and save yourself some work! Just do you water change before you get to the alert color and do a large change.

Yea, that's my thought too. Though I am worried about stressing the fish out with large changes. This qt stuff is all new to me. I have had tanks for years with no issues. Now after 15 or so fish dying I'm gun shy.

 

[Brew12]

We put one dose of copper in the tank the first day but we've been pulling it out with every water change everyday..

I think it would help to go over the math on why you may have more copper in your system than you may think. This will also show why a big change is more effective than multiple smaller changes.

If you start with a dose of .2ppm copper and do a 50% change, it goes down to .1ppm.
For the same amount of water you can do 5 changes at 10% each. Change 1 = .18ppm, Change 2 = .16, Change 3 = .146, Change 4 =.13, change 5 = .12

This shows that one large water change is 20% more effective at reducing chemical levels than 5 smaller changes using the exact same amount of water.

 

[Josett Waid]

I think it would help to go over the math on why you may have more copper in your system than you may think. This will also show why a big change is more effective than multiple smaller changes.

If you start with a dose of .2ppm copper and do a 50% change, it goes down to .1ppm.
For the same amount of water you can do 5 changes at 10% each. Change 1 = .18ppm, Change 2 = .16, Change 3 = .146, Change 4 =.13, change 5 = .12

This shows that one large water change is 20% more effective at reducing chemical levels than 5 smaller changes using the exact same amount of water.

Alright great! Thanks for the info.!

 

[Brew12]

Yea, that's my thought too. Though I am worried about stressing the fish out with large changes. This qt stuff is all new to me. I have had tanks for years with no issues. Now after 15 or so fish dying I'm gun shy.

You are doing fine! Just trust your badge, that's why it is in the tank. Trust me, my QT's haven't gone perfectly either. It is a learning curve.

People do large water changes all the time. Just match your temp and salinity of your make up water to the tank as best as possible. And mix it up in advance.

 

[Joey waid]

You are doing fine! Just trust your badge, that's why it is in the tank. Trust me, my QT's haven't gone perfectly either. It is a learning curve.

People do large water changes all the time. Just match your temp and salinity of your make up water to the tank as best as possible. And mix it up in advance.

Yea, that's another thing I do is have a 3 gallon bucket on stand by up to temp. I'm really not to worried about the copper per say, I was concerned that with the API test kit, that the copper would throw it off. The badge and the kit are way off.

 

[Brew12]

Yea, that's another thing I do is have a 3 gallon bucket on stand by up to temp. I'm really not to worried about the copper per say, I was concerned that with the API test kit, that the copper would throw it off. The badge and the kit are way off.

Yup, trust the badge, the copper will mess up the API kit. Just remember that you can't use Prime to reduce ammonia since you do have copper in the system!

 

[Joey waid]

Yup, trust the badge, the copper will mess up the API kit. Just remember that you can't use Prime to reduce ammonia since you do have copper in the system!

I don't even have any...

 

[Humblefish]

Copper shouldn't impact the alert badge. Even fairly low levels will throw off your other test kits.

^^Exactly this. Once you dose copper (even a small amount), you must rely solely upon the alert badge. However, there is a trick to viewing it's true color as it will often look green in the dark or even under ambient light. You must shine a bright white light either directly overhead or behind the ammonia alert badge.

 

[Joey waid]

^^Exactly this. Once you dose copper (even a small amount), you must rely solely upon the alert badge. However, there is a trick to viewing it's true color as it will often look green in the dark or even under ambient light. You must shine a bright white light either directly overhead or behind the ammonia alert badge.

I have noticed this too. I have a pure white led over them that use to work on watches. I noticed that if I point it directly at it it looks green but behind it looks tan. I have two tanks side by side with badges. I even swapped them back and forth and the color changes per tank, but the one tank is three weeks ahead of he other as far as the bio system, Plus there is a fire fish from a dt that had velvet. The new qt tank is 5 days old with everything I can add for a bio system, but it has a three inch trigger. The goal is to keep the trigger alive and as healthy as possible. It's just so picky on what it eats and they are so messy to boot. I'm changing floss every other day too.