Redfield ratio ?

[Ash321]

So i have high nitrates between 50-60ppm seems to be going up not down. My phos is right around 0.03.

I have been recommened to use nopox so i dosed my first dose yesterday.

Now this is my issue all the research i have done indicates that if you have low phosphate the nopox will not work.

Due to something called the redfield ratio. Anyone know if this is the case or not?

 

[Sallstrom]

You will probably need to add some PO4 in some way to your water if you want the NO3 to be reduced with carbon source. Bacteria need both, and with your values it's a risk that you'll end up with very low PO4 and unhappy corals(if you dose a carbon source).

The Redfield ratio is something that comes up now and then in the aquarium discussion. I haven't seen anything that proves that it should be a better ratio then others for reef tanks. What you need to be careful with is not to get to low NO3 or PO4.

In your case, with high NO3 and low PO4, you can also use a sulphur filter which only consumes NO3. We use it in some of our tanks. It's quite easy to do a DIY filter with sulphur.

Good luck!

/ David

 

[Ash321]

You will probably need to add some PO4 in some way to your water if you want the NO3 to be reduced with carbon source. Bacteria need both, and with your values it's a risk that you'll end up with very low PO4 and unhappy corals(if you dose a carbon source).

The Redfield ratio is something that comes up now and then in the aquarium discussion. I haven't seen anything that proves that it should be a better ratio then others for reef tanks. What you need to be careful with is not to get to low NO3 or PO4.

In your case, with high NO3 and low PO4, you can also use a sulphur filter which only consumes NO3. We use it in some of our tanks. It's quite easy to do a DIY filter with sulphur.

Good luck!

/ David

I have a reactor that is running rowaphos (or similar) would that work to empty and add sulphur into that?

 

[Sallstrom]

I have a reactor that is running rowaphos (or similar) would that work to empty and add sulphur into that?

Yes I can be done. If you want it more effective you'll need internal circulation, like a calcium reactor. A pump that takes water from the top and pumps it to the bottom of the filter. And a small air tube for water in, and water out.
The sulphur filters are low flow through and needs to be anaerobic to work.

Do a search for sulphur filter and I think you will find drawings on how they work.

/ David

 

[Sallstrom]

Here's a DIY filter
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2009-01/diy/index.php

 

[Ash321]

Here's a DIY filter
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2009-01/diy/index.php

Just found that 1. There seems to be mixed reviews on using sulphur

 

[Sallstrom]

Just found that 1. There seems to be mixed reviews on using sulphur

Yes, I know. There are some people that claims that it might be dangerous if something goes wrong with the filter.

We've used it some years now at work and haven't seen any bad effects. What we have seen is that it might be very effective in consuming NO3 if it runs the right way. But it might be hard to find the right size to run it all the time. Sooner or later the NO3 might get too low, but then it's only to turn of the filter.

/ David

 

[Marc88]

What about using Marinepure block? I know its not immediate but its another option.

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/marinepure-ceramic-biomedia-plate.html

 

[Ash321]

D

What about using Marinepure block? I know its not immediate but its another option.

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/marinepure-ceramic-biomedia-plate.html

Defitnley be exploring any option at this point would like to get it stable!

 

[Sabellafella]

So i have high nitrates between 50-60ppm seems to be going up not down. My phos is right around 0.03.

I have been recommened to use nopox so i dosed my first dose yesterday.

Now this is my issue all the research i have done indicates that if you have low phosphate the nopox will not work.

Due to something called the redfield ratio. Anyone know if this is the case or not?

Actually yes, if phosphate is limited, bacteria won't take nitrate in properly. Just make sure your feeding foods like flake or just a little heavier then your normal routine. Takes about 2 weeks or so for nopox to "kick in"

Also do not use red seas recommended dose. Start with about a quarter of what the recommend and work your way up over the course of that two weeks. Once it starts to drop cut your main dose in half. Its better off you take it slow. Limits the risk of any problems.

 

[Ash321]

Actually yes, if phosphate is limited, bacteria won't take nitrate in properly. Just make sure your feeding foods like flake or just a little heavier then your normal routine. Takes about 2 weeks or so for nopox to "kick in"

Also do not use red seas recommended dose. Start with about a quarter of what the recommend and work your way up over the course of that two weeks. Once it starts to drop cut your main dose in half. Its better off you take it slow. Limits the risk of any problems.

So would i benefit from turning my phos reactor off or just see where nopox naturally takes the nitrate (if anywhere) ?

 

[Marc88]

What are you doing for nutrient control? Do you have a fuge?

 

[Ash321]

What are you doing for nutrient control? Do you have a fuge?

I have a fuge but it only a week old so still waiting on it to kick in . I bought the set up second hand only 2 weeks ago so in trying to get it running decent.

 

[Ash321]

What about using Marinepure block? I know its not immediate but its another option.

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/marinepure-ceramic-biomedia-plate.html

Could these be leaching nitrare

 

[mcarroll]

The problem is that many things will suffer without PO4....your carbon dosing is partly causing the problem, so I'd stop.

In a new tank you don't want the bacteria using up all your nutrients, you want your corals and everything else doing it.....even normal green algae.

You don't have NO3 buildup, in other words....you have PO4-limitation. So stop worrying about NO3.

Stop carbon dosing, remove the extra bio-media, nutrient-media, algae reactors, et al.

Either allow PO4 to build back up naturally (may not be likely)....or it might be a good idea to add some PO4 fertilizer to restore some balance directly. Adding it yourself is a sure thing and there's no real downside to it. Do you have a PO4 test it? Let me know what you think.

 

[mcarroll]

Check out this thread too: Is nutrient control an effective method of treating algae in a reef?

 

[Skynyrd Fish]

I'd consider taking the rowaphos off line. You should then see a slow decline in NO3. Also your tank has had a reboot. It needs some time. Did you use the old sand? When my NO3 is high I add a little PO4. If My PO4 is getting high I add NO3. I test bi-weekly. The fuge will kick in shortly.

 

[Pntbll687]

Bulk reef supply just talked about the redfield ratio in their latest ulm video.

Are the high nitrates causing issues? Could this just be a small cycle after setting the tank up? Maybe a good water change could reduce levels to acceptable ranges.

How much biological media do you have? You may need more be able to fully complete the nitrogen cycle.

 

[Ash321]

I removed the cermaic media. That was the only thing else in there except floss which im changing every couple of days. Yeah il empty the phos reacotor tonight see if it balances up the local marine shop said he thinks its leaching nitrate from the liverock. Yeah i have a salifert phos kit the level is around 0.03 but almost un readable

 

[chipmunkofdoom2]

For what it's worth, the Redfield ratio is not a recommended ratio of nitrates to phosphates for reef aquaria. The Redfield ratio is simply an observation of how much nitrate and phosphate are contained in the tissues of planktonic organisms (an observation, by the way, that was first made in 1934, nearly 90 years ago). The Redfield ratio does not necessarily describe the conditions in which phytoplankton and other planktonic organisms live. It is simply how much phosphate and nitrate end up in phytoplankton.

The concept that phytoplankton use a lot of nitrate and a little bit of phosphate is useful. In general, many organisms in reef aquaria, including bacteria and macro algae, use more nitrate than phosphate. If we want to use the Redfield ratio as a general guide, that is, maintaining higher nitrates than phosphates, that seems like a logical approach to reef aquarium keeping. We should not, however, strive to maintain the Redfield ratio verbatim.