Removed Skimmer - Coral Coloration Increased
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J1a
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It really depends on the setup. In a hooded aquarium with a large skimmer, the skimmer is doing heavy lifting of oxygenation during lights off hours. I measured it with a dissolved oxygen sensor. On the other hand, during peak light hours, the skimmer can actually remove oxygen from the system as the water becomes super saturated with oxygen. So that's that.
I use my skimmer mostly for gas management, to scrub CO2 and help out with normalizing of oxygen levels.
tvan
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Most of the gases produced by the skimmer are released through the top of the skimmer and protein is exported. If your skimmer was indeed doing the heavy lifting . Lights on or off should make little difference to dissolved oxygen levels.
I use my one skimmer for protein export. The other has no skimmer just a large wave maker.
I use my one skimmer for protein export. The other has no skimmer just a large wave maker.
Mellotang
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I don’t know
water colliding with millions of tiny oxygen bubbles in a reaction chamber leads me to believe that would saturate water more that surface agitation
water colliding with millions of tiny oxygen bubbles in a reaction chamber leads me to believe that would saturate water more that surface agitation
J1a
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Perhaps the term heavy lifting is not used well. The skimmer is not that effective so that the water is fully in equilibrium with the room air all the time. However, based on what I observe, it has a observable impact on the dissolved oxygen level in the aquarium.
Its ability to regulate CO2 level through a scrubber is very significant and very measurable. While the equilibrium dyamics for O2 and CO2 are different, I would say the ability of the skimmer/scrubber to effectively adjust CO2 indicates its relevance for gas exchange.
J1a
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In some cases yes, in others, where the surface of the dt and sump is large; when the over flow and sump cascade is wide; when there is wind blowing over the dt (cooling perhaps), it may be not so cut and dry.
OP
OP
Dana Riddle
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That would be fairly simple to test. But I need a lab assistant!
No. The Apex graphs pH and no remarkable change. But I do agree fluorescent proteins are sensitive to pH modulations.
tvan
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If the CO2 levels in the tank room are high so is the level in your water. Again thanks to surface gas exchange, Wave makers, returns, anything that moves water cause gas exchange through surface agitation(ie the link I posted). Pond owners hove realized for years that surface water movement is the best means of gas exchange. Yes, I also have a large pond out back. Today's homes are so well insulated and don't allow for gas exchange with the outside = co2 buildup. Then a people, pets, a breathing DT and sump.
Pistondog
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High co2 level is the reason we run skimmer air lines outside, with good (ph improvement) results. If the skimmer air exchange were less efficient than surface agitation, outside air or co2 scrubbing in the skimmer would not work as well.
moz71
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This topic in this thread is interesting. I believed this theory as well. However I did watch a podcast on YouTube Where a wholesale coral grower did test on oxygen levels and co 2 levels in water with and without skimming and showed no impact on oxygen but reduces CO 2 which thinking about it makes sense too. Funny how we can theorize things sensibly but not always true
Bruce Burnett
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Well every once in a while I dump some of my skim-mate back into the sump. All corals give a feeding response. Bacteria is what makes the skimmer stink.
Hans-Werner
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About this theme I have another anecdote: Recently we got two microbiome analyses done, one from the system with the skimmer and one from a smaller single tank.
In the system with the skimmer the analysis found higher than average DNA of Pelgibacter (name means "bacteria of the open sea"), a planktonic bacterium, while in the single tank without skimmer the analysis found no Pelagibacter at all.
I think the latter might be because I used only dead decoration material. Maybe, during the next water change I will fill up with water from the skimmed system with the high DNA evidence of Pelagibacter to introduce this important bacteria genus.
I don't agree that OTS is caused by a lack of planctonic bacteria. I think OTS is caused rather by rapid nitrification and/or other shifts in nutrients (iodine, phosphate, other trace elements etc.). It is easy to reintroduce bacteria with new life rock, and I think it doesn't work with OTS, but it is nearly impossible to remove the surfaces of nitrifying biofilms that form in pipework, rock and other deco, and sand. They "steal" the traces of ammonium that corals need for good health.
cleaner_shrimp
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Interesting. Someone with similar results. I kept my nitrates around 7-9 and my phosphates low probably around what you have and my corals grew fast and improved the color. Also are more puffy.
Subsea
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About this theme I have another anecdote: Recently we got two microbiome analyses done, one from the system with the skimmer and one from a smaller single tank.
In the system with the skimmer the analysis found higher than average DNA of Pelgibacter (name means "bacteria of the open sea"), a planktonic bacterium, while in the single tank without skimmer the analysis found no Pelagibacter at all.
I think the latter might be because I used only dead decoration material. Maybe, during the next water change I will fill up with water from the skimmed system with the high DNA evidence of Pelagibacter to introduce this important bacteria genus.
I don't agree that OTS is caused by a lack of planctonic bacteria. I think OTS is caused rather by rapid nitrification and/or other shifts in nutrients (iodine, phosphate, other trace elements etc.). It is easy to reintroduce bacteria with new life rock, and I think it doesn't work with OTS, but it is nearly impossible to remove the surfaces of nitrifying biofilms that form in pipework, rock and other deco, and sand. They "steal" the traces of ammonium that corals need for good health.
You are right about all the nitrogen consumers in a healthy mature reef tank. I actually add ammonia to keep up with nitrogen demand on ornamental seaweed tanks.
From my understanding, the term. “Old Tank Syndrome“ is not well defined. I compare it to a climax forest where one species dominates and outcompetes most everything else.
Microbes determine the direction of a system which is why I look at these things thru the lens of the coral holibiont.
PS: First picture is 10 month mature ornamental seaweed tank. Second picture is 25 year mature system which could be called a climax forest of GSP.
Frontiers | Microbes in the coral holobiont: partners through evolution, development, and ecological interactions
In the last two decades, genetic and genomic studies have revealed the astonishing diversity and ubiquity of microorganisms. Emergence and expansion of the h...
www.frontiersin.org
[In the last two decades, genetic and genomic studies have revealed the astonishing diversity and ubiquity of microorganisms. Emergence and expansion of the human microbiome project has reshaped our thinking about how microbes control host health—not only as pathogens, but also as symbionts. In coral reef environments, scientists have begun to examine the role that microorganisms play in coral life history. Herein, we review the current literature on coral-microbe interactions within the context of their role in evolution, development, and ecology. We ask the following questions, first posed by McFall-Ngai et al. (2013) in their review of animal evolution, with specific attention to how coral-microbial interactions may be affected under future environmental conditions: (1) How do corals and their microbiome affect each other's genomes? (2) How does coral development depend on microbial partners? (3) How is homeostasis maintained between corals and their microbial symbionts? (4) How can ecological approaches deepen our understanding of the multiple levels of coral-microbial interactions? Elucidating the role that microorganisms play in the structure and function of the holobiont is essential for understanding how corals maintain homeostasis and acclimate to changing environmental conditions.]
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