Salinity and Acclimation from LA/DD

BigJohnny · Jul 10, 2017

Hey Reefers,

I have not ordered anything from Live Aquaria or Divers Den before, do they still arrive in 1.018 and 1.025 respectively? That was the general consensus but I was only able to find threads from 2014. I know they were acquired by petco and some time has passed obviously so I am hoping people have ordered from them regularly in 2017. I would like to match my QT tanks salinity so that I can just temp acclimate. Also, what about snails?

Thanks!

-Big J

CindyKz · Jul 10, 2017

I've never ordered from them, but I'm sure if you called or emailed they would share that information.

Shameless_Dood · Jul 10, 2017

Got an order from LA coming tomorrow, I will try and let you know!

BigJohnny · Jul 10, 2017

CindyKz said:
I've never ordered from them, but I'm sure if you called or emailed they would share that information.

You'd think, but no. Their site also has the question listed under f.a.q. but the answer doesn't even say what the specific gravity/salinity is. It just talks about how they take good care of fish, lol. Cool, thanks live aquaria

BigJohnny · Jul 10, 2017

Shameless_Dood said:
Got an order from LA coming tomorrow, I will try and let you know!

Thanks boss! I'd really appreciate it.

CindyKz · Jul 10, 2017

BigJohnny said:
You'd think, but no. Their site also has the question listed under f.a.q. but the answer doesn't even say what the specific gravity/salinity is. It just talks about how they take good care of fish, lol. Cool, thanks live aquaria

You asked and they wouldn't tell you? FOR REAL? I am sorry I suggested it then...and I am speechless.

BigJohnny · Jul 10, 2017

CindyKz said:
You asked and they wouldn't tell you? FOR REAL? I am sorry I suggested it then...and I am speechless.

Oh they told me........ "live aquaria and divers den keep there salinity the same to make it easy for customers, between 1.020 and 1.025" cool thanks, very helpful. I said that's a very wide range can you give me a specific number? She said "it's actually not its only 1/10th difference"

So in conclusion, she gave me a range of .005 specific gravity, and then was not smart enough to realize .005 is not 1/10th, nor that .005 is very significant. (Literally banging head into wall)

CindyKz · Jul 10, 2017

BigJohnny said:
Oh they told me........ "live aquaria and divers den keep there salinity the same to make it easy for customers, between 1.020 and 1.025" cool thanks, very helpful. I said that's a very wide range can you give me a specific number? She said "it's actually not its only 1/10th difference"

So in conclusion, she gave me a range of .005 specific gravity, and then was not smart enough to realize .005 is not 1/10th, nor that .005 is very significant. (Literally banging head into wall)

Considering the reputations LA and DD have, thats really dissapointing to hear.

BigJohnny · Jul 10, 2017

CindyKz said:
Considering the reputations LA and DD have, thats really dissapointing to hear.

I'm not surprised unfortunately, it's a massive successful operation, customer service doesn't need to be on point as far as stuff like that. It's also probably an "insurance policy answer" for them to give a range because I'm sure it fluctuates from time to time. The girl also clearly had no idea what specific gravity was or its importance. It's possible another rep would have been more knowledgeable though. Luckily, we have a great community on reef2reef and I'm sure several people will tell me what salinity/s.g. they got their LA or DD fish in!

lake985 · Jul 10, 2017

For what it's worth, I ordered a trio of Bartlett's anthias from DD about 3 months ago and they arrived in 1.025 salinity as stated on the website (http://m.liveaquaria.com/general/general.cfm?general_pagesid=377). I'm not sure about LA as I believe those livestock are drop shipped from another facility.

BigJohnny · Jul 10, 2017

lake985 said:
For what it's worth, I ordered a trio of Bartlett's anthias from DD about 3 months ago and they arrived in 1.025 salinity as stated on the website (http://m.liveaquaria.com/general/general.cfm?general_pagesid=377). I'm not sure about LA as I believe those livestock are drop shipped from another facility.

Thanks! That's in line with what I've heard from other reefers for divers den stuff. Unfortunately I've heard live aquaria itself averages 1.018-1.019. Not sure why the rep said 1.020-1.025 if the website says 1.025 lol. I'm ordering fish from both LA and DD so I'd like to hear from others more recently on LA shipments as well.

saltyfilmfolks · Jul 10, 2017

Why does the salinity matter so much if your acclimating them anyway. It's likely why they don't list the salinity. They don't need too.
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2006/1/aafeature2
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/6/fish

CindyKz · Jul 10, 2017

BigJohnny said:
It's also probably an "insurance policy answer" for them to give a range because I'm sure it fluctuates from time to time.

Seems likely.

BigJohnny said:
The girl also clearly had no idea what specific gravity was or its importance.

*sigh*

CindyKz · Jul 10, 2017

saltyfilmfolks said:
Why does the salinity matter so much if your acclimating them anyway. It's likely why they don't list the salinity. They don't need too.
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2006/1/aafeature2
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/6/fish

Many, myself included, prefer to match the salinity of their QT to the source water, briefly float the bag to bring the temperature to match, and then set the fish free. It avoids the prolonged exposure to ammonia that can accompany a slow drip acclimation. It takes preplanning though. Just discussing it in this thread, if you are interested
https://www.reef2reef.com/index.php?threads/232774/

I personally don't order fish online so the ammonia buildup isn't as much a concern for me, but I see the advantages.

BigJohnny · Jul 10, 2017

saltyfilmfolks said:
Why does the salinity matter so much if your acclimating them anyway. It's likely why they don't list the salinity. They don't need too.
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2006/1/aafeature2
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/6/fish

Because I am not drip acclimating them to match my display tank salinity. I am preparing a QT tank for them at the salinity they will arrive in. Drip acclimation for significant changes in salinity would have to be done over 1 to 2 days ideally, and that's not considering ammonia in the bag. This method is far superior and the best way to minimize stress and avoid shock from acclimation.

BigJohnny · Jul 10, 2017

CindyKz said:
Many, myself included, prefer to match the salinity of their QT to the source water, briefly float the bag to bring the temperature to match, and then set the fish free. It avoids the prolonged exposure to ammonia that can accompany a slow drip acclimation. It takes preplanning though. Just discussing it in this thread, if you are interested
https://www.reef2reef.com/index.php?threads/232774/

I personally don't order fish online so the ammonia buildup isn't as much a concern for me, but I see the advantages.

Precisely.

saltyfilmfolks · Jul 10, 2017

CindyKz said:
Many, myself included, prefer to match the salinity of their QT to the source water, briefly float the bag to bring the temperature to match, and then set the fish free. It avoids the prolonged exposure to ammonia that can accompany a slow drip acclimation. It takes preplanning though. Just discussing it in this thread, if you are interested
https://www.reef2reef.com/index.php?threads/232774/

I personally don't order fish online so the ammonia buildup isn't as much a concern for me, but I see the advantages.

But my point is , the science backs up the use of lower salinity in both propigation, quaretine and transport for theses reasons.

Acclimation is just that. Acclimation. To both salinity and ph.

saltyfilmfolks · Jul 10, 2017

BigJohnny said:
Because I am not drip acclimating them to match my display tank salinity. I am preparing a QT tank for them at the salinity they will arrive in. Drip acclimation for significant changes in salinity would have to be done over 1 to 2 days ideally, and that's not considering ammonia in the bag. This method is far superior and the best way to minimize stress and avoid shock from acclimation.

Re read the articles. It may change your mind.
Slow changes in a reef tank salinity levels are far different. That effects alkalinity and other parameters as well.

CindyKz · Jul 10, 2017

saltyfilmfolks said:
But my point is , the science backs up the use of lower salinity in both propigation, quaretine and transport for theses reasons.

Acclimation is just that. Acclimation. To both salinity and ph.

I wondered about pH too, it is addressed by Randy in that thread. The source, LFS, online retailer, whatever, can still use a lower salinity, just as the hobbyist can gradually lower it once the fish is out of the toxic environment of the bag. It's just a matter of knowing what salinity the fish will be at on arrival.

saltyfilmfolks · Jul 10, 2017

CindyKz said:
I wondered about pH too, it is addressed by Randy in that thread. The source, LFS, online retailer, whatever, can still use a lower salinity, just as the hobbyist can gradually lower it once the fish is out of the toxic environment of the bag. It's just a matter of knowing what salinity the fish will be at on arrival.

A the salinity will change depending on the temperature of the water.
B (article) bony fish readily acclimate to changes in salinity.