SB Reef Lights
- Thread starter ndz98
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timkenagy
~Unashamed 116~
This is what you say in your FAQ
I do doubt that Cree had Epistar make them end to end, more than likely they supplied the wafers and Epistar's fabs did the etching, but more research on that would be needed. What you say in your FAQ is a composition fallacy - even if Cree did simply contracted Epistar to produce their red dies for them end to end, that would not mean that Cree was or is using Epistar to produce all of their LEDs. As it is, nearly all of Cree's production fabs are in China, they produce only a handful of their LEDs in the US (despite receiving a $39 million tax credit in 2011 for the premise of keeping growth [and therefore jobs] in the US), but this does not mean that their LEDs do not still handily outperform Epistar's offerings both in efficiency and in phosphor tech.
On another note, did you know that Bridgelux doesn't make '3w' class LEDs in anything other than royal blue and green (and I'm not sure if green is still being produced)? They're almost exclusively sold in China for phosphor conversion by third party OEMs. The LEDs are no longer Bridgelux at that point, but obviously you still see the name used because the bigger a name you use the better it sells. The garbage white LEDs that OEMs try to pass as a 'Bridgelux' white diode are just that, garbage.
As for having 'enough' warm white, that is something that can be debated on and on and will vary by what an individual has in their reef.
Care to prove that with a watt meter?
Do you legitimately think that any reef LED fixture has enough red light to cause damage? Notice that the tests in this study were done with a minimum of 128 PAR of specifically deep red light. Even if I swapped every white, green, and red LED in the MarsAqua for warm white I would still be under 1/10 of what they were using for their tests.
In addition, 6500K metal halides are still regarded by many as the the best light for pure coral growth, and they still grow the living bajeezus out of corals.
Look at all that green and red light.
If you read closely, the deal is really for Epistar's benefit. Cree's phosphor tech is generations ahead of Epistar. Cree licensed some of their InGaN phosphor recipes to Epistar (as they have done for anyone else that has paid to do so). Think of it like when companies go through a merger. Companies don't actually merge - one company purchases the other. The company doing the buying calls it an acquisition, as it sounds good as they would have to have lots of capital to do so. The smaller company calls it a merger, because frankly it is much better for PR than just saying 'yeah, we got bought out.' It's much better for Epistar's PR if they said that Cree will also benefit from getting access to Epistar's phosphor tech, when realistically that is unlikely.
Actually, that would never happen. What is happening, though, is that the major manufacturers like Philips, Narva, Sylvania are investing heavily in solid state lighting, and as that market continues to grow, production will slow and eventually cease of mercury lighting, and the first to go will be the niche markets that won't tolerate sharp price increases on smaller and smaller production runs. Some reefers are willing to pay $50-100 for a metal halide lamp, but if that doubles, and then doubles again, etc, how many will be left with the pockets deep enough?
This may very well be true, however in my case I got better color and growth after switching from MH to LEDs. Point is in this hobby you show me 100 different systems and I'll show you 93 different ways thing are being done.
What's your beef with this guy really? He's not claiming to have a better product than say an Ecotech, Maxsect, AI etc... Do you really claim this big of an issue because he says his lights are a little better then the ones you can get off eBay? Really?? Just the mere fact that he's thrown down the money to sponsor this website that needs support MAKES HIS BETTER THAN THE ONES YOU CAN GET ON EBAY!!!
So what's the real issue? A hug?
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ndz98
Valuable Member
Oh that is so very true in this hobby lol
In respect to the wifi fan programming issue:
Mike I also have the same issue, seems to be a programming issue. From the default factory setting I could not get the fans to turn on. The app says factory is 50C. I then tried programming all sorts of diffrent set points via the app and the only setting I could get to turn on the fans was 0C for both start and stop temp. All other values did nothing. So until this is fixed in the app, I would suggest setting 0 for both. This setting seems to run the fans all the time. Otherwise I couldn't get the fans to turn on at all.
I see no criticism here. What I do see is a person who's well educated in the world of LED's used for marine aquariums. Which is what I've personally been looking for.
You may as well thank all the Black Box vendors out here beside SB, because their all getting their units from pretty much the same place. Diodes and all!
Do a search and read up on other black box vendors threads. They all have so much in common.
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ndz98
Valuable Member
Well atleast I know how to get the fans working now. Hopefully setting it to 0 works for me too
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ndz98
Valuable Member
I haven't tried yet. Was going to try tomorrow when the lights come on. And yours came set at 50C? It said they come set at 45C and that's how mine was. Either way we still are having the same problem lol. I watched it earlier get above 50 and the fans didn't come on either.
domination2580
Reef-a-nator
@sb reef light. Do I need to sign for the lights? Or will they leave them at my door? If they do that would be awesome because I want to open them when I get home from work
I don't have an SB unit but my black box says the same thing and in the almost 2yrs I've owned it the fan has never came on-lol.
Yeah I think somethings up with the factory programming. I'm sure Mike will have it sorted out soon. I'm going to put mine to the side for now since I have 2 ramping units running fine on my setup.
timkenagy
~Unashamed 116~
Yes.. We know.. And it's been repeated again and again. I'd prefer to not share my personal conversations but since this keeps getting repeated this is part of the conversation I had with the guy that work for the company.. I.e. The guy Mike gets them from (this stuff isn't really that hard to find out, and most of it Mike openly told me)
Point is.. As you see in the conversation that had nothing to do with Mike (it actually would benifit him to just sell to me, as he would've happily done) there is a difference between his and what you would get if you ordered directly from THE SAME EXACT MANUFACTURING FACILITY. (Mind you this is the same as his source not necessarily eBay but maybe) Now whether that difference (leg mounts, spectrum etc..) is worth the extra money? But I do see an "I'm snobby smart" attitude towards this guy. (That btw I've talked to once in a pm) that just became a sponsor here at R2R. I know I'm repeating myself.. But let's say the lights were exactly the same, he put them in a new box.. Takes on the warranty headaches and pays to support this very forum (something none of the other "black box companies that are the same" are doing.. That right there is worth the extra money. I mean that has to have some value right? At least lay off with the negativity?? Because he's not claiming anything false like his will outperform an AI.. Have you seen sponsor fees? I'd rather not chase him away because of what? I really don't understand what the beef is. It's a cheep Chinese Led light. He's been super clear from the beginning.
jedimasterben
Bubble coral sting good
Actually, with a hundred systems, you'd probably have over a hundred different ways of doing it lol
No beef for the guy, just the claims. I've studied lighting and the physics behind it for several years now, so I find someone making claims that aren't completely true and I let them know. Look around, you'll see that this is far from the first time I've corrected a reseller before, and certainly not the first about a custom Chinese panel, and it typically ends up with their marketing being corrected and in some cases a better product in the end.
domination2580
Reef-a-nator
Ok can anyone tell me if I need to sign for these lights?
domination2580
Reef-a-nator
I hope someone chimes in
SB Reef Lights
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Yes you need to sign with DHL. If you will not be home you can call them and arrange to leave a signed note on the door with the tracking number on it.
SB Reef Lights
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As for the claims on the website they are researched and valid. We can go back and forth all day quoting research papers to prove both sides of the debate. Including densities of each of the clades compared to absorption rates at absorption peaks with the Chloroplast with in the Zooxanthallae. The bottom line is the peak absorption points are proven. We hit those well. Better than any other black box. The argument about more warm white for aesthetics is just that, personal bias. I have been tweaking the diode layout and spectrum for over 2 years from my original heavy warm white MarsAquas, and each time growth and color development improved. There is a reason our replacement Retro Fit Board is our number one seller. Folks have seen better results once upgrading.
The claim about Cree and Epistar working together was proven. Simple as that. If folks want to argue to the nth degree, go for it, it's your bandwidth. The statement was about why we do not use Cree (Cost), however pointing out that Epistar is the next best choice, showing the vote of confidence Cree has in Epistar by working with them. Don't read more into that statement than is meant.
In every thread there will always be someone who wants to be the smartest person in the room, it's the nature of the internet. Nothing wrong with that, it normally leads to a good debate and several folks learning something new. However often folks assume that person is speaking the gospel when in fact they might not be. If you want to learn more about lighting, join the Aquarium Lighting group on Facebook. Folks like Kessil, Cruz Arias, Tullio Dellaquila (who likes more warm whites) and Dana Riddle are there and will be glad to explain things as technically as you want. Even there with several field experts in lighting, they do not all agree on things. That is why I will not debate it here, as you know it's a debate that will never end.
However our results speak for themselves.
The claim about Cree and Epistar working together was proven. Simple as that. If folks want to argue to the nth degree, go for it, it's your bandwidth. The statement was about why we do not use Cree (Cost), however pointing out that Epistar is the next best choice, showing the vote of confidence Cree has in Epistar by working with them. Don't read more into that statement than is meant.
In every thread there will always be someone who wants to be the smartest person in the room, it's the nature of the internet. Nothing wrong with that, it normally leads to a good debate and several folks learning something new. However often folks assume that person is speaking the gospel when in fact they might not be. If you want to learn more about lighting, join the Aquarium Lighting group on Facebook. Folks like Kessil, Cruz Arias, Tullio Dellaquila (who likes more warm whites) and Dana Riddle are there and will be glad to explain things as technically as you want. Even there with several field experts in lighting, they do not all agree on things. That is why I will not debate it here, as you know it's a debate that will never end.
However our results speak for themselves.
SB Reef Lights
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jedimasterben, No beef taken
I have also studied lighting and physics for years. I have a BS in Nuclear Engineering from UofM. I remember switching from 5700K halides with T12 03s to the first 6500K bulbs and thinking , "WOW", that's way to blue. lol. I appreciate the debate and your input. You have many valid points. On others we disagree. That's okay. Even the major light manufacturers do not agree on everything. And often what we take for fact is changed a couple years later in this hobby. There is still more we do not know than we do. 
Zane
Active Member
Here's a pretty relevant thread where star wars Ben was talking more. u/Eagle said it perfectly, and with that I give you young Jedi Ben's tank. Some people talk about it, some people BE about it.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/w...-cool-white-help-clear-the-haze.172080/page-4
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/w...-cool-white-help-clear-the-haze.172080/page-4
