Should sellers be responsible for FedEx delays?
- Thread starter DeepWaterAddict
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titlowda
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I will say I had this issue 2 weeks ago. Arranged shipment date and it was delayed by a day and a half by UPS. They flat said they will not cover the cost and only shipping cost.
Lonely reefer's
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If there're some issue with corals after 1hrs to one week,take picture and contact seller very day for an update
If seller ask for water parameter/more picture,provided what he/she ask
Give sell 2/3 weeks to decided before open the case.
PS: paypal doesn't recognized 1 hrs dead or alive policy
MAKE SURE PAY AS GOOD AND SERVICE
If seller ask for water parameter/more picture,provided what he/she ask
Give sell 2/3 weeks to decided before open the case.
PS: paypal doesn't recognized 1 hrs dead or alive policy
MAKE SURE PAY AS GOOD AND SERVICE
Lonely reefer's
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Oh sometime it not the seller fault,the corals doesn't like to be shipped.
Flexin
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Paypal has a disputes process, just like your credit card. If you dispute a charge they will review it and make a determination if you should or should not get your money back. Most likely those decisions may not be the same depending on the details and who presents them best (the seller or buyer). If you use a credit card linked to your paypal account, you can start with pay pal, then if you don't like the result, do it through your credit card. However, paypal does not like you using your credit card's dispute process and will threaten to close your account if you do.
anit77
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I see both sides of this. But look at it from the sellers perspective, especially large volume ones. Every carrier is going to have delays it happens. But let's stay someone signs for a package and it's a significant other, child, neighbor... and the package is left on the counter for a couple hours or more before the person that actually bought it opens and starts the acclimation process. How is that the sellers fault? I don't think its unreasonable to expect the the buyer get back to the vendor within 1 hour of signing for the delivery if there's a problem. If your not ready to handle the live animal immediately on arrival have the seller hold off shipment until a time you know you will be ready for receipt.
On the buyers end when there's a potential for weather to be an issues, heat, cold, hurricane's... it should be prudent to hold off on the purchase. When its something crazy expensive, like a gem tang, why not pick it up at the airport or local delivery hub? Remove a chance for a delay and time spent in a delivery truck that isn't the best for climate control. But there should be reasonable allowance on the time to get back to the vendor in those instances. Now lost or missorted packages should be on the seller. No it's not their fault but if it's of no fault on the buyer they should step up and help their customer.
Lastly most lfs's will order something special for you. Yes, you'll likely pay more but you'll see the animal alive before you pay. Doa's and delays are removed from the equation. If there's a deposit it should be stated that if the Lfs can't deliver a healthy animal it is refundable.
On the buyers end when there's a potential for weather to be an issues, heat, cold, hurricane's... it should be prudent to hold off on the purchase. When its something crazy expensive, like a gem tang, why not pick it up at the airport or local delivery hub? Remove a chance for a delay and time spent in a delivery truck that isn't the best for climate control. But there should be reasonable allowance on the time to get back to the vendor in those instances. Now lost or missorted packages should be on the seller. No it's not their fault but if it's of no fault on the buyer they should step up and help their customer.
Lastly most lfs's will order something special for you. Yes, you'll likely pay more but you'll see the animal alive before you pay. Doa's and delays are removed from the equation. If there's a deposit it should be stated that if the Lfs can't deliver a healthy animal it is refundable.
tiggs
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I've always drawn the line at whether it's an actual business or a hobbyist selling frags at a price that's substantially cheaper than a typical vendor. Businesses have (or at least SHOULD have) a certain percentage of losses factored into their business plan and margins for situations like this. In my eyes, that's part of the premium that you should expect for paying full retail prices for something from an actual company. In the case of someone selling a few frags on the side to make a few bucks, I'd never hold them responsible for an issue they had no control over. I'm not talking about the guys selling 1/4" of acro for $800; I mean the guys selling something that would go for $500+ at a retail store for $150 to get some of his investment back. He's not running a full-on business and isn't charging a premium (part of which has a certain percentage of expected loss factored in), so that's the risk I take if I want to bargain shop. If it was a hobbyist selling something insanely rare and/or expensive, then I work out DOA terms ahead of time and come to an agreement prior to making the deal.
Honestly though, it's on the customer to understand or discuss the terms of unforeseen delays and/or DOAs prior to making the deal 100% of the time. If you aren't ok with how they handle DOAs, then don't purchase from them. We all have the choice to spend our money wherever we'd like.
In a perfect world, the carrier would offer insurance and cover the loss, but unfortunately, that's not the way it is. It would also be great if aquaculture insurance covered these types of losses for businesses and everyone would win, although I can't think of a way they'd ever be able to offer that so that it wasn't incredibly susceptible to fraud.
Honestly though, it's on the customer to understand or discuss the terms of unforeseen delays and/or DOAs prior to making the deal 100% of the time. If you aren't ok with how they handle DOAs, then don't purchase from them. We all have the choice to spend our money wherever we'd like.
In a perfect world, the carrier would offer insurance and cover the loss, but unfortunately, that's not the way it is. It would also be great if aquaculture insurance covered these types of losses for businesses and everyone would win, although I can't think of a way they'd ever be able to offer that so that it wasn't incredibly susceptible to fraud.
There are other options, but they are not easy and can cost more. I once sold some very rare Genicanthus Angelfish and I took the box to Southwest at the airport and the seller had them about 5 hours later. I did not pay for this, but it can be a few hundred bucks. If our plane was going to not take off, then they were going to call me so that I could go and get them back.
Airline freight is a good option for rare or expensive stuff.
I had a package delayed for 24 hours going to ca1ore and everything was fine even with 2 day shipping.
Airline freight is a good option for rare or expensive stuff.
I had a package delayed for 24 hours going to ca1ore and everything was fine even with 2 day shipping.
dede
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One of the reasons I shop online is because my LFS will not cover anything once you pay for it and I have had a lot of issues with stuff from their store.
I personally look for the vendor's policy on shipping and their guarantee and have passed on quite a few purchases because of their policy.
I agree with those above that the seller is in business and just like other businesses should cover these kind of losses in their business expenditures. It should never be on the customer.
I do find that most of the sellers I see online have this buyer is totally and solely responsible once it leaves their shop policy. The only way I see to change this is for buyers to insist on the seller's responsibility and to only shop those sellers. Also, let the none compliant know they are losing your business because of their shipping and 1-2 hour DOA.
I personally look for the vendor's policy on shipping and their guarantee and have passed on quite a few purchases because of their policy.
I agree with those above that the seller is in business and just like other businesses should cover these kind of losses in their business expenditures. It should never be on the customer.
I do find that most of the sellers I see online have this buyer is totally and solely responsible once it leaves their shop policy. The only way I see to change this is for buyers to insist on the seller's responsibility and to only shop those sellers. Also, let the none compliant know they are losing your business because of their shipping and 1-2 hour DOA.
BoomCorals
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They cannot be insured.
Fritzhamer
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It’s possible things have changed but.... a decade ago I shipped quite a bit with Fed-Ex. I used them because they were far more professional than UPS and I was shipping documents where time was of the essence.
Often a delay would occur and I’d call fedex to say “if it isn’t there by 10am it doesn’t need to get there at all.” Once in awhile this would happen and I would be credited $100, more if I had insured it for more. Fed-Ex guarantees their overnight deliveries by a certain time and they stand by it.
Once they had an issue and hired a messenger service to meet the truck on route and take it to my destination so it could be delivered on time. in my experience Fed-Ex is amazing.
UPs on the other hand often says things like “we don’t know where the package is, it’ll probably turn up in a few days. If you haven’t gotten it in a week try calling us back.”
Often a delay would occur and I’d call fedex to say “if it isn’t there by 10am it doesn’t need to get there at all.” Once in awhile this would happen and I would be credited $100, more if I had insured it for more. Fed-Ex guarantees their overnight deliveries by a certain time and they stand by it.
Once they had an issue and hired a messenger service to meet the truck on route and take it to my destination so it could be delivered on time. in my experience Fed-Ex is amazing.
UPs on the other hand often says things like “we don’t know where the package is, it’ll probably turn up in a few days. If you haven’t gotten it in a week try calling us back.”
Daniel@R2R
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Good discussion. I see both sides of it. Ultimately, in an ideal world, it's the shipping company that takes the loss on delayed deliveries. Since we don't live in an ideal world, I'd prefer shared loss in a situation where neither the buyer or seller are at fault.
rkpetersen
walked the sand with the crustaceans
Online, I mostly buy from established dealers. I'm sure I'm paying more overall than if I were buying from hobbyists, but my experience unfortunately has been that I can't trust any particular individual random person to 1) show honest photos, 2) sell clean livestock without undisclosed risks, 3) pack properly, 4) ship properly, 5) communicate well, and 6) have a dead-or-dying-on-arrival policy that is fair.
I however do agree that it is on the buyer to know each seller's 'rules' and decide for themselves whether they're reasonable or not, and if not, don't do business with them. But new hobbyists may not even realize that such tight restrictions exist. It isn't obvious that someone would require a photograph of something dead in the bag within just one hour of arrival. I remember, early on I bought a large Hawkins echinata frag from some guy. He frankly didn't pack all that well imo and the water in the bag was cloudy on arrival. Now of course I would contact him right away. But then, as a new aquarist and not knowing the rules, all I could think of was getting the frag into clean warm water to see if it recovers. Of course when I realized that the frag was completely dead and contacted him later that day about it, past his deadline which at the time I didn't know existed, he was aggressively suspicious that I was trying to cheat him somehow. Just one example of an interaction I don't care to repeat.
I however do agree that it is on the buyer to know each seller's 'rules' and decide for themselves whether they're reasonable or not, and if not, don't do business with them. But new hobbyists may not even realize that such tight restrictions exist. It isn't obvious that someone would require a photograph of something dead in the bag within just one hour of arrival. I remember, early on I bought a large Hawkins echinata frag from some guy. He frankly didn't pack all that well imo and the water in the bag was cloudy on arrival. Now of course I would contact him right away. But then, as a new aquarist and not knowing the rules, all I could think of was getting the frag into clean warm water to see if it recovers. Of course when I realized that the frag was completely dead and contacted him later that day about it, past his deadline which at the time I didn't know existed, he was aggressively suspicious that I was trying to cheat him somehow. Just one example of an interaction I don't care to repeat.
There is no doubt that Battlecorals has a great policy. But I still don't think you should try to impose one company's policy on another. Maybe I'm just more sensitive to this due to being a small business owner, but this kind of thinking really irritates me lol
Rispa
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It's not like buyers do everything in their power to make sure things go well most of the time. For example why do we have boxes delivered instead of picking them up at the post office? Or have them delivered to a place of business or friend's house that gets the mail early.
