Siamese Sump Setup

exarkun1178 · Mar 22, 2016

One thing complicating my search for sumps, my dimensions. My tank is 14" deep. Most sumps are 16" or more deep. I found one that came in 10" but it was a small 20 gallon sump.

Searching now for a company that does custom sumps.

Mwells · Mar 22, 2016

Sounds like you need a new tank, not a sump [emoji23]

LegitFish · Mar 22, 2016

In order for this to work at all, you absolutely need to plumb the sumps together. If they are working as two separate sumps, you WILL always have a problem with water level, and God forbid one of your pumps goes out, you will overflow the one sump. The two overflows constantly drain at different speeds, and will cause problems if they aren't plumbed together.

exarkun1178 · Mar 22, 2016

I agree with the sumps being Plummer together. My plan calls for one joint at the skimmer section. Then a backup at the return pump section.

I wanted a tank that was not deep for a few reasons. Space, weight, lighting are amount the reason. My focus remains on the length of the tank providing more visual appeal, and swimming "run" for the fish. Plus 144" is the width of the wall I am placing the tank on.

Rydogg420 · Mar 22, 2016

Nope nope nope. Don't do these two sumps like that. It's pointless in my opinion. One well designed sump is the way to go. Plus you could take the money from all the redundancy equipment and buy a nice controller and other kit to help make sure your sump isn't going to fail and flood anything. Plus having to clean 2 of everything is not going to motivate you after a few months. Lol.

CodyRVA · Mar 22, 2016

exarkun1178 said:
One thing complicating my search for sumps, my dimensions. My tank is 14" deep. Most sumps are 16" or more deep. I found one that came in 10" but it was a small 20 gallon sump.

Searching now for a company that does custom sumps.

I'm so very confused as to why your tanks dimensions has anything to do with your sumps dimensions other than the fact that the sump would fit in the stand space under your tank? Assuming you will have to get a custom built sump(s) to make this idea work, thats even more money you could put to a controller to accomplish the same thing, +1 @Rydogg420, but if money isn't an issue than rock on.

exarkun1178 · Mar 22, 2016

Yes the size issue is due to stand width. Though I am thinking of making the stand wider. I watched a video earlier that showed a large tank sitting on granite I'm thinking if I make the stand wider I could get away with a granite top and still have it look good.

My original idea had it all flush with a false wall.

Finding a granite slab 144" is becoming an issue, I hate seems.

I Admit I make my own problems. But like most of you I assume, you know what you like.

CodyRVA · Mar 22, 2016

exarkun1178 said:
Yes the size issue is due to stand width. Though I am thinking of making the stand wider. I watched a video earlier that showed a large tank sitting on granite I'm thinking if I make the stand wider I could get away with a granite top and still have it look good.

My original idea had it all flush with a false wall.

Finding a granite slab 144" is becoming an issue, I hate seems.

I Admit I make my own problems. But like most of you I assume, you know what you like.

That would look slick, but you mentioned wanting a shallow tank for multiple reasons, weight being one of them, i can only assume the granite is going to add a considerable amount...?

exarkun1178 · Mar 22, 2016

1" granite is considerable less then say 100 gallons. If the stand grows to say 18" it won't be too bad spread across 12 feet with the tank and water etc.

Oldtimer · Mar 22, 2016

I have a twin sump setup. It wasn't my initial plan, but when the tank stand manufacturer added vertical supports the middle of the rear of the stand despite the drawing not calling for it (plenty of support elsewhere in the design), I would not be able to remove the sump for cleaning, etc once installed. I put some thought into it and ultimately decided on a twin sump design. The display tank is ~240 gal with a box steel frame stand sitting in a fish room and a wood facad in the finished living space from where we view the tank. It happens to be our entertainment area in the basement which means a home entertainment system and large TV. The stand essentially has three 24" wide by 30" deep compartments. I decided to use the outer 2 compartments for the sumps and the middle compartment for a custom wood shelving unit that houses stereo/DVD equipment and center speaker for the entertainment system. It actually worked out very well in the end. Each sump has a dedicated 1.5" feed from the tank's built in overflow. Some flow from one of those feeds is diverted to the skimmer (externally mounted Bubble King) and then out to one of the sumps. The two sumps return flow through 2" pipes that Tee just before heading into a Sequence Dart Gold. It works very well. I have no issues with water level as it equalizes between the two sumps and never had any problems running dry or overflowing. The system has been up and running since early 2010. BRS has a couple pics in some of their videos. I'll dig one up and post here shortly.

Oldtimer · Mar 22, 2016

mcarroll · Mar 22, 2016

I think some consideration could be given to going sumpless. Look up Tunze's Reefpack 250 and 500.

The dual sumps is novel in a computer schematic, but in real life that's just two of everything for you to take care of. Not what you want the tank to be about....but it will be. At most, use the dual sumps, but as others have, use it as one sump like the plumbing is just a set of baffles.

Redundancy is almost always a double edge sword - use only as needed.

LegitFish · Mar 23, 2016

Oldtimer said:

The only reason this system works is because the two sumps are connected. His original plan of his two sumps did not show the sumps connected

exarkun1178 · Mar 23, 2016

The two horizontal yellow pipes in the diagram are connecting/ leveling pipes.

Fundamentally I would want to tune each side to operate independently but acknowledge that it will be a challenge. So have the two flow pipes in anticipation of being needed.

Oldtimer · Mar 23, 2016

LegitFish said:
The only reason this system works is because the two sumps are connected. His original plan of his two sumps did not show the sumps connected

I didn't read through it detail to be honest. Just thought I'd share what I did for inspiration as I saw this thread hit my email. Yes, they really do need to be connected.

traumajeff · Mar 23, 2016

exarkun1178 said:
The two horizontal yellow pipes in the diagram are connecting/ leveling pipes.

Fundamentally I would want to tune each side to operate independently but acknowledge that it will be a challenge. So have the two flow pipes in anticipation of being needed.

My original plan was to turn my 125g into my sump, and toss it under the 240g. I had to rethink this when I upgraded skimmers and figured out that the collection cup wouldn't clear the gap between the stand and sump. I wanted to keep a larger sump, but without heavy modification to the stand, I couldn't get anything in there but an 84g long. With my dual 40g sumps, I could slide them through the current openings, and not have to worry about removing bracing or panels. I got the volume is wanted, and easy installation and maintenance. I see zero problem with 2 sumps.

In my experience, your "connecting" pipes should connect the 2 return pump sections. With your baffles, every other compartment should stay at the level of the baffle. Your only fluctuations should be in the return section with evaporation. Technically, each sump would operate independent from the other, except for the return sections. With this in mind, I wouldn't see a need to connect other compartments. I chose to go with 2 connections, in case one ever became clogged, but I guess 1 would work if it were large enough.

Back to the redundancy issue... I have 2 return pumps. This is because I have 2 returns. Sure, I'll have to clean an extra pump, and yes it's wear on 2 instead of 1, but I have the piece of mind that if one goes out, then the other will compensate until I can fix the problem. I've had a pump die 20 minutes into my shift, and my wife wasn't able to fix the issue. I work 12 hr shifts, so it's nice to know everything will now be cool until I get home. I also run 2 heaters. Mostly because of space, but I've found that I can set them at different temps, and basically use one as a backup for unexpected temperature fluctuations or if the primary fails. I see no problem with redundancy here. A controller wouldn't help me if I had a failure 6 hours into my 12 hour shift, as I can't just leave work to fix my tank.

As far as the dual skimmers go... if you have space for a single, higher rated skimmer, I'd go with that.

Why not use one sump for mechanical (skimmer and reactors), and the other just as a fuge? My plan is to run chaeto in one compartment and xenia in the next. Xenia will help to suck up nutrients, and I can harvest and sell it when it grows in.

exarkun1178 · Apr 3, 2016

ImageUploadedByREEF2REEF1459739187.838997.jpg

Built the stand today.

There is not much room width wise. Not that I am surprised. Seeing it is always better. I'll have to use the full 14".

Tank arrives tomorrow [emoji106]