Skimmerless

[iMi]

So, I think I'm done with using the skimmer and a refugium. Going forward with a refugium only. Nitrates kept bottoming out and dosing them seems counterintuitive (the reef is producing its own and I am removing it just to add it back). I feed pretty heavily and still occasionally bottom out. Now that the skimmer is not there, I am holding fairly steadily around 4ppm. Just seems more stable and everything is happy. What I worry about is long-term and other nutrients we may not be testing for building up, but I figured I can always "reset" with a 20% water change every couple of weeks.

Does anyone else find the skimmerless approach to be better? Really curious what everyone thinks!

 

[\m/reefsnmetal\m/]

I tried going refugium only and a few weeks after removing my skimmer my DT was overcome with algae. Now I have a refugium and canister filter and no more algae issues. As my tank matured and some corals grew my filtration needs fluctuated. Sometimes I had too much filtration and others too little. You could be fine just don't get complacent.

 

[Miami Reef]

So, I think I'm done with using the skimmer and a refugium. Going forward with a refugium only. Nitrates kept bottoming out and dosing them seems counterintuitive (the reef is producing its own and I am removing it just to add it back). I feed pretty heavily and still occasionally bottom out. Now that the skimmer is not there, I am holding fairly steadily around 4ppm. Just seems more stable and everything is happy. What I worry about is long-term and other nutrients we may not be testing for building up, but I figured I can always "reset" with a 20% water change every couple of weeks.

Does anyone else find the skimmerless approach to be better? Really curious what everyone thinks!

You can certainly go skimmerless. I believe the main benefit of a skimmer is aeration.

I highly recommend keeping the skimmer for the future in case things change with your nutrient management. Don’t sell it off.

 

[iMi]

You can certainly go skimmerless. I believe the main benefit of a skimmer is aeration.

I highly recommend keeping the skimmer for the future in case things change with your nutrient management. Don’t sell it off.

No doubt, but here's a question. Wouldn't Chaeto, which is being lit up 24/7 and pearling nonstop, profide sufficient oxygen saturation in the tank?

I suppose it could also be subsidized with a simple air pump.

 

[Garf]

So, I think I'm done with using the skimmer and a refugium. Going forward with a refugium only. Nitrates kept bottoming out and dosing them seems counterintuitive (the reef is producing its own and I am removing it just to add it back). I feed pretty heavily and still occasionally bottom out. Now that the skimmer is not there, I am holding fairly steadily around 4ppm. Just seems more stable and everything is happy. What I worry about is long-term and other nutrients we may not be testing for building up, but I figured I can always "reset" with a 20% water change every couple of weeks.

Does anyone else find the skimmerless approach to be better? Really curious what everyone thinks!

I think skimmers do very little, except aeration. I removed mine 3 or 4 weeks ago. I’ve got the needle wheel pump in the sump just churning the water over. Gets a bit of a foam head on the surface but it tends to die down, presumably as the bacteria eat it.

 

[Miami Reef]

No doubt, but here's a question. Wouldn't Chaeto, which is being lit up 24/7 and pearling nonstop, profide sufficient oxygen saturation in the tank?

I suppose it could also be subsidized with a simple air pump.

Oxygen isn’t the issue. It’s the CO2 that skimmers help with.

However, refugiums also remove CO2 which benefits in that department. I believe increasing the flow through the tank (getting good surface agitation) is more than enough.

I don’t use a skimmer for my acro and clam QT.

 

[iMi]

I tried going refugium only and a few weeks after removing my skimmer my DT was overcome with algae. Now I have a refugium and canister filter and no more algae issues. As my tank matured and some corals grew my filtration needs fluctuated. Sometimes I had too much filtration and others too little. You could be fine just don't get complacent.

Interesting. I appreciate your input. I'm curious to know if you measured nitrates and phosphates through out the experiment. Did anything else change? As the saying goes, corralation doesn't mean causation, right?

You mention you added a canister, which would increase your biological filtration. I am convinced canisters, when used properly, offer similar benefit as a deep sand bed. So, you would be de-nitrafing your water and presumibly you're also running some type of media that is helping remove nutrietns. Do you think this is what's happening?

By the way, I think canisters are underrated in this hobby. I don't run one now since I have a sump and everything works well, but I used the Fluval 407 to "seed" a new tank when I made a switch. Just ran the canister for a few months and then had it on a side of the new tank for a few weeks. No cycling of any kind took place, no algea, no diatoms... They can be a brilliant piece of equipment, in my opinion.

 

[ReefGeezer]

Maybe the question should be answered relative to the size of the system and the degree of the bioload. So... 10 gallons, two little fish... sure... hundreds of gallons, lots of big fish... possible, but maybe not practical.

 

[\m/reefsnmetal\m/]

Interesting. I appreciate your input. I'm curious to know if you measured nitrates and phosphates through out the experiment. Did anything else change? As the saying goes, corralation doesn't mean causation, right?

You mention you added a canister, which would increase your biological filtration. I am convinced canisters, when used properly, offer similar benefit as a deep sand bed. So, you would be de-nitrafing your water and presumibly you're also running some type of media that is helping remove nutrietns. Do you think this is what's happening?

By the way, I think canisters are underrated in this hobby. I don't run one now since I have a sump and everything works well, but I used the Fluval 407 to "seed" a new tank when I made a switch. Just ran the canister for a few months and then had it on a side of the new tank for a few weeks. No cycling of any kind took place, no algea, no diatoms... They can be a brilliant piece of equipment, in my opinion.

I did measure nitrates and phosphates and while I have since lost all of that data by getting my log wet I do remember having a spike. I also lost all of my LPS when this happened. I tried placing the skimmer back and dosing NoPox; the problem was that my sump was too deep and the stand too short to get the skimmer at optimal water level to function correctly. Also the NoPox turned all of the GHA into pink slime that was even worse as it broke free and clogged my pumps, skimmer, and overflow. I went with a no name canister filter from amazon as a last resort and let the fuge do its thing. I added some additional cuc and quit dosing NoPox. I think the canister made a huge difference and I've developed a maintenance routine with it that makes it super easy. Due to budget issues I have not been able to replenish my regents for nitrates/phosphates and thus have not replaced any of the corals that were lost. With that being said, my surviving corals have rebounded amazingly and throughout this whole mess I did not lose any inverts or fish. I'm happy to share the info and hope it's helpful.

 

[Biologic]

Oxygen isn’t the issue. It’s the CO2 that skimmers help with.

However, refugiums also remove CO2 which benefits in that department. I believe increasing the flow through the tank (getting good surface agitation) is more than enough.

I don’t use a skimmer for my acro and clam QT.

I've been tracking CO2 with a high end CO2 meter in my home so this might vary for you guys, but I am sure that this is constant for everyone.

Depends on what your home's CO2 is. Just like surface agitation of the water's surface and skimmer can work for and against you for CO2. They just help your tank reach equilibrium with your atmospheric ambient CO2 levels in your home. Now if you run the skimmer line outside, the skimmer works far better because CO2 outside is significantly lower than inside. Everyone's home will have higher CO2 inside than outside -- which leads into the discussion of pH.

Now if you have a huge fish and bio load, the inhabitants could contribute higher CO2 levels than what is atmospherically around in ambient home levels. Then the skimmer works for you in that situation.

A refugium always works for you because its always sucking up CO2, assuming it's not breaking down itself for whatever reasons if its not happy and assuming that the rate is always constant.

My vote is for both. Refugium and skimmer -- with the skimmer line ran outside. Generally speaking, you will be more successful with a skimmer alone as well.

 

[Freenow54]

I would not do without a skimmer. Had a huge phosphate problem it helped save the day. Also saw videos of people dosing vibrant, and the skimmer works overtime for that application. I am not a fan of Dosing. Also agree with canister filters I run a 45 with one and a hang on the back skimmer. I am happy with the results. My coral are ultra happy that's what I know

 

[alain Bouchard]

running skimmer 1 day a week for 6 month, think I ll just do without for good. 180 gal, medium bioload, mixed reef, 10 years old with 15 gal refugium. water change 10% every 2 months. carx. low nutrient. all stable.

 

[Timfish]

Nope.

 

[Reffetsevla]

I run one simply for gas exchange. I run it pretty dry, don't have to empty the collection bottle often at all. I also run a fuge on a pretty short timer right now. NO3 holding about 7 and PO4 about 0.07, both are within my target ranges.

 

[Biologic]

Nope.

great tanks. They remind me of the tanks that got me in the hobby. Love to try one without a skimmer one day.

 

[BanjoBandito]

Nothing beats consistent water changes. We over complicate it with our insane equipment. I’m guilty of it!

 

[jft]

Honestly I am done with skimmers used them for 25 plus years various forms and was frustrated alot with some performance. I believe smaller skimmers NOT bigger are better. I tried tunze waste of money and bubble magus, lifereef, and reef octo skimmed the best. Classic series JUST seemed to work the best .ASM was ok but LOUD I look for real long term Value. That for me is my EHEIM filters better than reactors and my sump is just a place to put more media if I choose. Spent thousands on skimmer over the years and I could have saved LOTS of dough. KNOWLEGE Is the KEY. JUST my experience. My results were NO better with skimmers . Honestly. Just do small water changes and provide good flow and lighting and Your tank will thrive

 

[harsha22]

So, I think I'm done with using the skimmer and a refugium. Going forward with a refugium only. Nitrates kept bottoming out and dosing them seems counterintuitive (the reef is producing its own and I am removing it just to add it back). I feed pretty heavily and still occasionally bottom out. Now that the skimmer is not there, I am holding fairly steadily around 4ppm. Just seems more stable and everything is happy. What I worry about is long-term and other nutrients we may not be testing for building up, but I figured I can always "reset" with a 20% water change every couple of weeks.

Does anyone else find the skimmerless approach to be better? Really curious what everyone thinks!

I have a waterbox marineX 60.2 with a sump. Tried using aquamaxx WS-1 for a week but looks like there was not enough bioload and the tank was full of micro bubbles for a week.
Have been running skimmer less since 2 months. Keeping the aquamaxx just in case I might need it. Will do the break in separately in a bucket or with the dirty water i collect after the water change.

In-place of the skimmer I added the following.
Carbon bags below my sock filter (Not inside the sock but below the sock)
Brightwell mini bio cubes and mini No3 cubes
UV scrubber/filter

The above does seem to be keeping the nitrates low with 4 fishes and no corals, will know more how it goes once I start adding 3 more fishes and more corals. But my intention is to have a skimmerless tank.

The only challenge I face now is PH, since I do not have a skimmer, how can I raise the PH without dosing???

 

[\m/reefsnmetal\m/]

I have a waterbox marineX 60.2 with a sump. Tried using aquamaxx WS-1 for a week but looks like there was not enough bioload and the tank was full of micro bubbles for a week.
Have been running skimmer less since 2 months. Keeping the aquamaxx just in case I might need it. Will do the break in separately in a bucket or with the dirty water i collect after the water change.

In-place of the skimmer I added the following.
Carbon bags below my sock filter (Not inside the sock but below the sock)
Brightwell mini bio cubes and mini No3 cubes
UV scrubber/filter

The above does seem to be keeping the nitrates low with 4 fishes and no corals, will know more how it goes once I start adding 3 more fishes and more corals. But my intention is to have a skimmerless tank.

The only challenge I face now is PH, since I do not have a skimmer, how can I raise the PH without dosing???

Increasing aeration should help. You could try a couple of air stones in the sump.

 

[vlangel]

I have been keeping reefs for 25 years. I started out without a skimmer, but then added one in hopes of more thriving coral. Now I am back to skimmerless and my coral have never looked better.