So I got more fish!

[Philipgonzales3]

Correct it's Paul B here on R2R that has all the pertinent info necessary for keeping mandarins, filefish, etc. He is the one who has the DIY feeder everyone uses. If you must buy a feeder, SB Reef sells a pod hotel that's supposed to work well.

Believe it or not I do a lot of reading every time I get new pets/family members. Read for months before I got my first dog at the age or 27 or so.

Got a cat eventually too, though I'm not much of a cat person. Supposed to be the wife's cat...


The Red Ear Sliders were supposed to be my wife's also. We bought two quarter size red ear sliders and they set us up with our shoe box sized death trap. That quickly turned into a 55 gallon Long and had me thinking about getting a stock tank. Everyone thought I was crazy when I told them they needed 10 gallons of water for every 1 inch of shell. I of course was the one who got to do all the tank maintenance for "her" turtles. Lol.

I read the spec sheet or what not for every fish I've gotten. I also made sure to double check with my LFS at check out if these new additions needed anything special and they said nope, just keep feeding what I'm feeding.

Anyway just trying to show that I am responsible, i just like to lean towards the side of overstocked and without QT. One day that may change, like @PirateDan said it's all going good until it doesn't. I guess only time will tell but I am hoping to be in it for the long haul as this is my test on wether or not I will be able to and desire to maintain a large in the wall or peninsula style aquarium when we purchase our own house. Thinking somewhere around 300 gallons but just an idea so far.

 

[Why-Me]

You seem to be on point with everything you're doing, as well as cautious and being backed up and ready for what may happen. Good on you, I read many posts where that just isn't the case and they're always wondering what went wrong. Agreed, a bit of reading and educating yourself ahead just makes things easier to understand as well as actually perform the tasks or skills that are needed.
I feel why that's half the reason mine isn't set up yet. I keep reading of different methods and variables and change aspects of my build accordingly, unfortunately it's taking longer than I wanted. But I do realize I will/should be happier in the end with a higher chance of success or larger margin for error whichever way you look at it. Most of the starter threads I read boil down to: Preparation, Patience & Redundancy will save you time, Money$ and hassle and then possibly even keep you in the hobby.

 

[Bill_Moorman]

Don’t rinse your bio media or balls you want them to build up nitrate

Wait...what? He’s doing FOWLR, he wants as low as nitrate as possible.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

You seem to be on point with everything you're doing, as well as cautious and being backed up and ready for what may happen. Good on you, I read many posts where that just isn't the case and they're always wondering what went wrong. Agreed, a bit of reading and educating yourself ahead just makes things easier to understand as well as actually perform the tasks or skills that are needed.
I feel why that's half the reason mine isn't set up yet. I keep reading of different methods and variables and change aspects of my build accordingly, unfortunately it's taking longer than I wanted. But I do realize I will/should be happier in the end with a higher chance of success or larger margin for error whichever way you look at it. Most of the starter threads I read boil down to: Preparation, Patience & Redundancy will save you time, Money$ and hassle and then possibly even keep you in the hobby.

I forgot to mention I have a spare Fluval flex 15 gallon on standby in my daughter's room. She is 1.5 years old and sleeps in our bed lol. That's another story. Her middle name is Ariel so that's why the mermaid sea related stuff.



Also have a 20 gallon Long along with a couple of extra filters. This is the reason I chose to use the ceramic and other biomedia in my sump. It's more for seeding a new tank quickly than for the main DT biological filtratuon.

I think patience is the hardest thing for many of us. Some things we just have to learn ourselves. I am 29, so I'm still fairly young and I think patience mostly comes with age. Trying to work on that one more.

I was on the fence and the only two people that I personally know that have kept reef tanks (both of them I went to high school with). They both said nah I think QT is overkill and not to waste my time. I think their advice is likely wrong in that regard. Well they are probably right that it's a low probability but it is huge impact risk.

My backup plan is to break down the rock, pull the fish from the DT to probably at least 2 QT tanks and then treat while the DT goes fallow for 72+ days. Basically at this point I acknowledge the risk and decided against QT. It bothers me that I couldn't be patient enough and honestly I was scared to kill my fish by treating them which I'm sure is a common fear. I just couldn't do it to the little guys.


The thing I noticed with reef tanks is their are no hard rules. The whole many ways to run a reef tank can definetly be head spinning at times.


Haha sorry for rambling on. Thanks for input!

 

[Philipgonzales3]

Wait...what? He’s doing FOWLR, he wants as low as nitrate as possible.

If I ever switch to a reef tank, which I think will happen eventually this whole too low nitrates thing is going to be hard to wrap my head around. I mean I get the basic concept but still. Dosing nitrate in a tank is just weird to me lol.

Hopefully their are some easy to raise corals that don't require any dosing besides the salt. Haven't looked that far ahead yet but don't ever see myself doing an SPS tank that requires constant dosing. Seems too hard, but who knows what the future holds. I always stayed away from saltwater because I've heard it is hard. So far it's not that hard, just an extra parameter so far. Expensive and requires more equipment, but not that hard for just a FOWLR so far.

 

[Bill_Moorman]

If I ever switch to a reef tank, which I think will happen eventually this whole too low nitrates thing is going to be hard to wrap my head around. I mean I get the basic concept but still. Dosing nitrate in a tank is just weird to me lol.

Hopefully their are some easy to raise corals that don't require any dosing besides the salt. Haven't looked that far ahead yet but don't ever see myself doing an SPS tank that requires constant dosing. Seems too hard, but who knows what the future holds. I always stayed away from saltwater because I've heard it is hard. So far it's not that hard, just an extra parameter so far. Expensive and requires more equipment, but not that hard for just a FOWLR so far.

I don’t think you’ll be needing to dose nitrates. Nitrates are the end product of the nitrogen cycle and will accumulate over time as fish defecate. You will want nitrates to be around 5-10ppm, and phosphates under .25, but you don’t want either at 0. Corals use them for food. Eventually as you get into corals, you’ll find that a good quality salt, water changes, and feeding your fish will be sufficient for basic stuff like softies and some LPS.

I would tell you to get the following testing kits:

Hanna Alkalinity (dKH should be around 8-9)
Hanna Phosphate ULR (under .25)
Red Sea Master Test kit (Alkalinity, Calcium and Magnesium) (calcium 400-450ppm, Magnesium 1400-1600)
Nyos Nitrate (between 5 and 10ppm)
Refractometer (35ppt)
API for pH is fine ( 7.9-8.2, but don’t chase numbers here)

API test kits for anything else are not accurate enough for you.

Further, if you think you want corals, just take the plunge after you get your water parameters within spec and get some hardy corals like a Duncan, some Acans, or some Montipora. For the love of god do not get Kenya Tree, Clove Polyps, or Xenia. They are trash coral that overrun a tank fast.

The reason I say jump in is that the corals are filtering your water and they make the hobby more fun.

What lights do you have?

 

[Philipgonzales3]

I don’t think you’ll be needing to dose nitrates. Nitrates are the end product of the nitrogen cycle and will accumulate over time as fish defecate. You will want nitrates to be around 5-10ppm, and phosphates under .25, but you don’t want either at 0. Corals use them for food. Eventually as you get into corals, you’ll find that a good quality salt, water changes, and feeding your fish will be sufficient for basic stuff like softies and some LPS.

I would tell you to get the following testing kits:

Hanna Alkalinity (dKH should be around 8-9)
Hanna Phosphate ULR (under .25)
Red Sea Master Test kit (Alkalinity, Calcium and Magnesium) (calcium 400-450ppm, Magnesium 1400-1600)
Nyos Nitrate (between 5 and 10ppm)
Refractometer (35ppt)
API for pH is fine ( 7.9-8.2, but don’t chase numbers here)

API test kits for anything else are not accurate enough for you.

Further, if you think you want corals, just take the plunge after you get your water parameters within spec and get some hardy corals like a Duncan, some Acans, or some Montipora. For the love of god do not get Kenya Tree, Clove Polyps, or Xenia. They are trash coral that overrun a tank fast.

The reason I say jump in is that the corals are filtering your water and they make the hobby more fun.

What lights do you have?

I had read in a post about dosing nitrate but I think it was to deal with a specific problem. Maybe dino's? Of course like you said I likely won't need to do that. I think most people on here like corals more and I like fish more. May not be the case but maybe.

Hanna Alkalintiy and ULR Phosphate are on the list. As well as the red sea master kit. I'll be sure to order these soon.

Hadn't heard of the NYOS nitrate kit. I'll add it to the list. Actually I just bought this now on eBay. Should be here by the 1st. I was wanting a more accurate way to test nitrate so thank you very much for that.

For salinity I use a Milwaukee MA887. Reads the test solution right on 1.025. Best $100 I spent so far. I love this thing. Makes measuring salinity easy.

For PH I use a PH meter very similar to a TDS meter. Was about $20. I use the API PH test to verify but it seems accurate and has calibration solution which I should probably recalibrate soon.

For lights I am using something I had left over from an old 20 long. It's an aqueon modular LED light. 3 watts each strip, 3 strips for a total of 9 watts. Based on what I've read on planted forums I believe the par may be about 30 par at 12". Probably will need to ditch the light if I go for any corals yea?

Would something like this do me any good?

https://www.saltwateraquarium.com/o...c-loop-pro-dual-led-system-current-usa/#first

The reason I like it is because it can sit on top of my lid without any modification. It has a built in timer and some corny effects which I like.

If not then I'm open to getting a radion XR30w Pro as it's recommended spread is 2' x 2' which is perfect since that's the footprint of my tank. 20" height I believe. I'd need help figuring out how to mount it though.

 

[Hemmdog]

Wait...what? He’s doing FOWLR, he wants as low as nitrate as possible.

To burn ammonia and nitrite. For the nitrogen cycle. If you cleaned your media constantly nothing would be able to really process ammonia. Rocks alone will have trouble unless they are super mature.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

To burn ammonia and nitrate. For the nitrogen cycle. If you cleaned your media constantly nothing would be able to really process ammonia. Rocks alone will have trouble unless they are super mature.

Rinsing biomedia in used tank water doesn't kill benifical bacteria. They aren't that easy to kill. I've even heard rinsing them in chlorine water doesn't kill them either although I wouldn't be that crazy to try that.
At least that's what I think I've read.

 

[Bill_Moorman]

That’s awesome! Glad those kits will help you out. I really like the NYOS test. It’s accurate and easy to differentiate between the readings.

For the light, I’m running two AI Prime HDs with them mounted on the tank.

Keeping the parameters where I told you and with those lights my corals are growing very well. My dad had one similar to the one you posted and it never produced great growth.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

@brandon429 can you confirm rinsing my bio media in used tank water weekly is OK. That it doesn't stall the growth of BB? Wouldn't want to be hurting my BB now.

 

[Bill_Moorman]

Don’t rinse your bio media or balls you want them to build up nitrate

I would actually suggest for him to get rid of the bio balls. He doesn’t have any coral currently and bioballs are a nitrate factory. If he kept them, he would want to rinse them to remove detritus so that it doesn’t become available for the bacteria to convert into nitrate.

OP if you start to see cyano or turf algae it’s likely an excess nutrient issue.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

That’s awesome! Glad those kits will help you out. I really like the NYOS test. It’s accurate and easy to differentiate between the readings.

For the light, I’m running two AI Prime HDs with them mounted on the tank.

Keeping the parameters where I told you and with those lights my corals are growing very well. My dad had one similar to the one you posted and it never produced great growth.

My only concern would be how they are mounted. Like I don't want to mess up the lid I just made. I'll look more into it though. Going to try to wait a while before I dive in but we'll see. Maybe be one week may be six months. Eventually it will happen I think lol. At least to try some of the easier stuff.

 

[Bill_Moorman]

@brandon429 can you confirm rinsing my bio media in used tank water weekly is OK. That it doesn't stall the growth of BB? Wouldn't want to be hurting my BB now.

I know you weren’t asking me, however, you can leave your bio media in the tank for a few months. If you decide to swish it around in tank water you’ve sucked out via a WC you will be fine.

What specifically do you have as bio media? Do you have a sump?

 

[Philipgonzales3]

I would actually suggest for him to get rid of the bio balls. He doesn’t have any coral currently and bioballs are a nitrate factory. If he kept them, he would want to rinse them to remove detritus so that it doesn’t become available for the bacteria to convert into nitrate.

OP if you start to see cyano or turf algae it’s likely an excess nutrient issue.

Noted, I will probably slowly remove the bio balls eventually. Right now I want lots of options for seeding any new or QT tanks that may be needed to be setup in the future. I figured if I kept them clean then I could move them over if needed without having to pull any of my rock from the DT.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

I know you weren’t asking me, however, you can leave your bio media in the tank for a few months. If you decide to swish it around in tank water you’ve sucked out via a WC you will be fine.

What specifically do you have as bio media? Do you have a sump?

I have a sump that came with the SCA 50pnp package.

My middle section is pretty much full of biomedia. Good sized bag (white bag) of ceramic cylinders, black bag of bio balls, a small container of Fluval bio cylinders that can be loaded into a Fluval u3 subermsable filter.

 

[Bill_Moorman]

I have a sump that came with the SCA 50pnp package.

My middle section is pretty much full of biomedia. Good sized bag (white bag) of ceramic cylinders, black bag of bio balls, a small container of Fluval bio cylinders that can be loaded into a Fluval u3 subermsable filter.

Oh dude you’re golden. Just let that sump get messy (like in finding Nemo lol) and you’ll be fine.

This is my sump, as you can tell I need to prune some chaeto.

My advice: Seriously let it sit as is for a month. Just do a WC every couple of weeks and keep testing for ammonia. You’ll be set up for a killer system before you know it.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

Oh dude you’re golden. Just let that sump get messy (like in finding Nemo lol) and you’ll be fine.

This is my sump, as you can tell I need to prune some chaeto.

My advice: Seriously let it sit as is for a month. Just do a WC every couple of weeks and keep testing for ammonia. You’ll be set up for a killer system before you know it.

Sweet, it's a little messier now because that's a pic from a little while back. I wipe down the glass in my sump every day and was going to get a wet vac thingy that goes over a 5 gallon bucket to keep it spotless. Haha may be OK for a FOWLR but going to have to learn to let things go if I go reef. So you think I can eventually have a refugium in here with some cheato?
wasn't sure if my sump sections were optimized for it as I've heard it's not the best sump.

 

[Bill_Moorman]

You totally could do a chaeto chamber, but probably not a fuge with that sump. You could make one out of a 10g tank, that’s what I did!

If you google DIY sump designs there are plenty out there!!

 

[Bill_Moorman]

I would put the chaeto in the chamber where your bio media currently is! They make super nice lights for the sump but mines simply a led grow bulb (I’m in CO, so because of all the folks growing pot here it’s easy to find good bulbs hahah) in a shop light. Believe it or not but that entire chamber grew out from a baseball sized chunk!