Lionfish Lair
Renee
+1. Where is this data? I would love to have a discussion about it so we can clear the air.
So, come on, let's talk about it.....
One question I guess to ask is, where did you hear this data? Did you read any studies on it or?
Soaking food in garlic and vitamins...
- Thread starter Congaken
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+1. Where is this data? I would love to have a discussion about it so we can clear the air.
So, come on, let's talk about it.....
One question I guess to ask is, where did you hear this data? Did you read any studies on it or?
OP
OP
Congaken
Valuable Member
Back to Jack Wattley, the discus guru...he uses garlic for intestinal worms...while ich may be different in salt vs. fresh, I don't think the worms are...I'm using the fresh garlic and soaking the food in it...
Lionfish Lair
Renee
I'm going to do a little search for him so get some background for the discussion.
OP
OP
Congaken
Valuable Member
Peer review...shmeer review...most of the research in this game is done by observant hobbiests...Jack Wattley, on the other hand is very well known and respected...the #1 discus breeder and researcher...I believe this is meaningful...I guess you use garlic or you don't...
Lionfish Lair
Renee
Militz, T., Southgate, P., Carton, A., & Hutson, K. (2013). Dietary supplementation of garlic ( Allium sativum ) to prevent monogenean infection in aquaculture. Aquaculture, 408, 95-99.
Lee, J., & Gao, Y. (2012). Review of the Application of Garlic, Allium sativum , in Aquaculture. Journal of the World Aquaculture Society, 43(4),
Militz, T., Southgate, P., Carton, A., & Hutson, K. (2014). Efficacy of garlic ( A llium sativum ) extract applied as a therapeutic immersion treatment for N eobenedenia sp. management in aquaculture. Journal of Fish Diseases, 37(5), 451-461.
Guo, J., Kuo, C., Hong, J., Chou, R., Lee, Y., & Chen, T. (2015). The effects of garlic-supplemented diets on antibacterial activities against Photobacterium damselae subsp. piscicida and Streptococcus iniae and on growth in Cobia, Rachycentron canadum. Aquaculture, 435, 111-115.
(2015). Efficacy of an Extract from Garlic, Allium sativum , Against Infection with the Furunculosis Bacterium, Aeromonas salmonicida , in Rainbow Trout, Oncorhynchus mykiss. Journal of the World Aquaculture Society, 46(5), 569-569.
Schram, E., Pedrero, Z., Cámara, C., Van Der Heul, J., & Luten, J. (2008). Enrichment of African catfish with functional selenium originating from garlic. Aquaculture Research, 39(8),
Mohebbi, A., Nematollahi, A., Dorcheh, E., & Asad, F. (2012). Influence of dietary garlic ( A llium sativum ) on the antioxidative status of rainbow trout ( O ncorhynchus mykiss ). Aquaculture Research, 43(8), 1184-1193.
Talpur, A., & Ikhwanuddin, M. (2012). Dietary effects of garlic ( Allium sativum ) on haemato-immunological parameters, survival, growth, and disease resistance against Vibrio harveyi infection in Asian sea bass, Lates calcarifer (Bloch). Aquaculture, 364, 6-12.
Colorni, A., Avtalion, R., Knibb, W., Berger, E., Colorni, B., & Timan, B. (1998). Histopathology of sea bass ( Dicentrarchus labrax ) experimentally infected with Mycobacterium marinum and treated with streptomycin and garlic ( Allium sativum ) extract. Aquaculture, 160(1), 1-17.
I have 25 articles in my hand right now, that means there's gobs of studies out there. If you want me to include the rest of the 25, I can, but that's a lot of typing. LOL.
...
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Lionfish Lair
Renee
Don't rule out freshwater studies as a valid source of data. Garlic is being evaluated in both and there's a lot of crossing over of effects.
I was looking at garlic when we were going to send out a "supplement" with fish shipments. You have to provide studies to have these things approved, as you can't print claims on the package without it. I wasn't interested in the anti-parasitic effects or the immunity boost, as I was taking care of that with different ingredients. I was interested in adding it for it's effects on cyanide poisoning.
I was looking at garlic when we were going to send out a "supplement" with fish shipments. You have to provide studies to have these things approved, as you can't print claims on the package without it. I wasn't interested in the anti-parasitic effects or the immunity boost, as I was taking care of that with different ingredients. I was interested in adding it for it's effects on cyanide poisoning.
Lionfish Lair
Renee
BUT, just in case someone wants to use the freshwater argument and say they don't apply (and we know someone will try even if it's just someone linking to this thread from another forum), these are specific to marine. This is a good place to start.
Guo, J., Kuo, C., Chuang, Y., Hong, J., Chou, R., & Chen, T. (2012). The effects of garlic-supplemented diets on antibacterial activity against Streptococcus iniae and on growth in orange-spotted grouper, Epinephelus coioides. Aquaculture, 364, 33-38.
Lee, J., & Gao, Y. (2012). Review of the Application of Garlic, Allium sativum , in Aquaculture. Journal of the World Aquaculture Society, 43(4),
Militz, T., Southgate, P., Carton, A., & Hutson, K. (2014). Efficacy of garlic ( A llium sativum ) extract applied as a therapeutic immersion treatment for N eobenedenia sp. management in aquaculture. Journal of Fish Diseases, 37(5), 451-461.
Guo, J., Kuo, C., Hong, J., Chou, R., Lee, Y., & Chen, T. (2015). The effects of garlic-supplemented diets on antibacterial activities against Photobacterium damselae subsp. piscicida and Streptococcus iniae and on growth in Cobia, Rachycentron canadum. Aquaculture, 435, 111-115.
Talpur, A., & Ikhwanuddin, M. (2012). Dietary effects of garlic ( Allium sativum ) on haemato-immunological parameters, survival, growth, and disease resistance against Vibrio harveyi infection in Asian sea bass, Lates calcarifer (Bloch). Aquaculture, 364, 6-12.
Colorni, A., Avtalion, R., Knibb, W., Berger, E., Colorni, B., & Timan, B. (1998). Histopathology of sea bass ( Dicentrarchus labrax ) experimentally infected with Mycobacterium marinum and treated with streptomycin and garlic ( Allium sativum ) extract. Aquaculture, 160(1), 1-17.
ROTH, M., RICHARDS, R., & SOMMERVILLE, C. (1993). Current practices in the chemotherapeutic control of sea lice infestations in aquaculture: a review. Journal of Fish Diseases, 16(1),
Madsen, H., Buchmann, K., & Mellergaard, S. (2000). Treatment of trichodiniasis in eel ( Anguilla anguilla ) reared in recirculation systems in Denmark: alternatives to formaldehyde. Aquaculture, 186(3), 221-231.
Ringø, E., Sperstad, S., Myklebust, R., Mayhew, T., & Olsen, R. (2006). The effect of dietary insulin on aerobic bacteria associated with hindgut of Arctic charr ( Salvelinus alpinus L.). Aquaculture Research, 37(9),
Guo, J., Kuo, C., Chuang, Y., Hong, J., Chou, R., & Chen, T. (2012). The effects of garlic-supplemented diets on antibacterial activity against Streptococcus iniae and on growth in orange-spotted grouper, Epinephelus coioides. Aquaculture, 364, 33-38.
Lee, J., & Gao, Y. (2012). Review of the Application of Garlic, Allium sativum , in Aquaculture. Journal of the World Aquaculture Society, 43(4),
Militz, T., Southgate, P., Carton, A., & Hutson, K. (2014). Efficacy of garlic ( A llium sativum ) extract applied as a therapeutic immersion treatment for N eobenedenia sp. management in aquaculture. Journal of Fish Diseases, 37(5), 451-461.
Guo, J., Kuo, C., Hong, J., Chou, R., Lee, Y., & Chen, T. (2015). The effects of garlic-supplemented diets on antibacterial activities against Photobacterium damselae subsp. piscicida and Streptococcus iniae and on growth in Cobia, Rachycentron canadum. Aquaculture, 435, 111-115.
Talpur, A., & Ikhwanuddin, M. (2012). Dietary effects of garlic ( Allium sativum ) on haemato-immunological parameters, survival, growth, and disease resistance against Vibrio harveyi infection in Asian sea bass, Lates calcarifer (Bloch). Aquaculture, 364, 6-12.
Colorni, A., Avtalion, R., Knibb, W., Berger, E., Colorni, B., & Timan, B. (1998). Histopathology of sea bass ( Dicentrarchus labrax ) experimentally infected with Mycobacterium marinum and treated with streptomycin and garlic ( Allium sativum ) extract. Aquaculture, 160(1), 1-17.
ROTH, M., RICHARDS, R., & SOMMERVILLE, C. (1993). Current practices in the chemotherapeutic control of sea lice infestations in aquaculture: a review. Journal of Fish Diseases, 16(1),
Madsen, H., Buchmann, K., & Mellergaard, S. (2000). Treatment of trichodiniasis in eel ( Anguilla anguilla ) reared in recirculation systems in Denmark: alternatives to formaldehyde. Aquaculture, 186(3), 221-231.
Ringø, E., Sperstad, S., Myklebust, R., Mayhew, T., & Olsen, R. (2006). The effect of dietary insulin on aerobic bacteria associated with hindgut of Arctic charr ( Salvelinus alpinus L.). Aquaculture Research, 37(9),
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OP
OP
Congaken
Valuable Member
cyanide...what, what!...
Lionfish Lair
Renee
For fish caught via the cyanide method.
TylerS
Active Member
I didn't try to access any of those to read them, but care to share the conclusions? Just because there was a study done doesn't mean that it's beneficial or not, or that the study was well done. Sometimes the conclusions are a stretch just to make the research seem relevant and not a waste of the authors or sponsors time and money... They could even be contradicting one another for all I know.
Just look at all of the studies for vitamins and supplements for humans.
Now if every study documented a clear statistically valid benefit that would be something!
What do the people do who's business is raising and farming fish? Do they use garlic and how?
Lionfish Lair
Renee
Fair enough, I know what's within because I've read them. I understand you can't take my word for it, but if there's one thing I recognize it's good research studies.... it's what do for a living.
These articles ARE what farmers are doing/researching..... a lot of those articles you'll note are from the journal "Aquaculture". I can summarize a couple of them, if someone wanted to pick a couple for me to tackle, but that's about all I'll be able to manage. A good way to not suspect a skewed result is to you read it yourself. I know many cannot get these articles, so of course I'll help bring the info here, but ya gotta wanna try to participate.
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I do this. It may not be best way, but it what I do.
1. 1 cube portion
2. 10ml tank water
3. 3-5ml garlic guard by seachem (I just eyeball this one)
4. 0.5ml selcon
5. Wait 5 minutes
6. another 10ml tank water spayed into it, and break apart.
7. Wait 5-10 minutes
8. Stir
9. pour into a tiny strainer, and discard liquid 75% liquid.
10. Dip strainer and get food out in tank, and pour in remaining liquid and food in container.
Now to improve on this I might try adding seachem focus to the mix. As it supposedly binds the selecon to the food better.
EDIT --- About what Garlic does.
It does increase feeding response greatly. If you use it every meal as soon as garlic hits water fish go crazy. It will also help train fish to switch to different foods as the smell or taste of garlic is associated with food, thus everything that has garlic must be food so they will try it. Also it masks the flavor of selcon or other additives that turn fish off from the food.
It may have other benefits, but it certainly aids in feeding. So regardless if it does or doesn't it is unimportant to how and why people use it with selcon, other additives, or medications.
1. 1 cube portion
2. 10ml tank water
3. 3-5ml garlic guard by seachem (I just eyeball this one)
4. 0.5ml selcon
5. Wait 5 minutes
6. another 10ml tank water spayed into it, and break apart.
7. Wait 5-10 minutes
8. Stir
9. pour into a tiny strainer, and discard liquid 75% liquid.
10. Dip strainer and get food out in tank, and pour in remaining liquid and food in container.
Now to improve on this I might try adding seachem focus to the mix. As it supposedly binds the selecon to the food better.
EDIT --- About what Garlic does.
It does increase feeding response greatly. If you use it every meal as soon as garlic hits water fish go crazy. It will also help train fish to switch to different foods as the smell or taste of garlic is associated with food, thus everything that has garlic must be food so they will try it. Also it masks the flavor of selcon or other additives that turn fish off from the food.
It may have other benefits, but it certainly aids in feeding. So regardless if it does or doesn't it is unimportant to how and why people use it with selcon, other additives, or medications.
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