Substitute for ChaetoGro/Chaeto grow?

[Azra]

Hi everyone!
Wanted to ask what would be good substitute for ChaetoGro in macroalgae tank?
I am located in Europe (Croatia) and can't get hold of Brightwells ChaetoGro nor Continuum Chaeto grow.

 

[GARRIGA]

If only F2 is used; system will be nitrogen limited. I use ammonia to deal with that.

Ammonium Chloride or another source? At what ratio?

 

[Subsea]

Ammonium Chloride or another source? At what ratio?

It’s not the same for every system. Dosage is determined by system demand. Nitrate is the target to measure. Keeping a fixed ratio is unnecessary as long as nothing bottoms out. Given intense light, macro will grow fast until nutrient limited.

PS: With respect to what ratio to feed elements to a macro tank, as long as elements are available macro will consume until limited and any one of the elements can halt growth. In my experiences, when fast growing seaweed is nitrogen limited, it will go sexual as a survival technique. Most of the macro algae in the reef keeping hobby has a N of 30:1 while phytoplankton (micro algae) has a N of 16:1, which is the Redfield Ratio.

 

[Subsea]

Because I grew Red Ogo for human consumption, a regional agriculture lab was used for both quality control & quality assurance for inspection by executive chef/owners of Asian restaurants.

Gracilaria parvispora

Thus is the dry analysis of Gracilaria Paspoides: Red Ogo.

 

[olonmv]

If you can get this, you can diy a solution to add to your tank. When I did, my cheato grew fast.
Manganese Sulfate Monohydrate - 32% Mn - 1 Pound https://a.co/d/0AltfGD

 

[flashsmith]

I don't know... Fish poop always seems to work for me. A lot of that stuff is just snake oil. I grow pom pom macro and feed it back to my tangs.

 

[GARRIGA]

I don't know... Fish poop always seems to work for me. A lot of that stuff is just snake oil. I grow pom pom macro and feed it back to my tangs.

Pom Pom something I’m considering because I’m not a fan of green and it has structure which seems would hold up better with drains from what I’ve read.

Has yours grown fast when lots of poop available and did you notice it raised your ph? Latter main reason I’m back to setting up a refugium. Only viable solution left for what I plan on doing.

 

[Derrick0580]

Brightwell replenish?

 

[Subsea]

Pom Pom something I’m considering because I’m not a fan of green and it has structure which seems good up better with drains from what I’ve read.

Has your’s grown fast when lots of poop available and did you notice it raised your ph? Latter main reason I’m back to setting up a refugium. Only viable solution left for what I plan on doing.

Marine Plants in the Aquarium

macroalgae, marine plants, caulerpa, refugium substrate, marine macroalgae for sale

www.marineplantbook.com

[A beautiful species of Gracilaria featuring rigid, flame shaped branches that form a tight symmetrical bush. It is lightly calcified so the addition of calcium is recommended. In shallow water it is often found in very large clumps covered in colonial tunicates or encrusted with epiphytic bryozoans. The coloration varies between deep crimson red to bright orange depending on the amount of light provided. It features a small holdfast that can be attached to rocks or left as a free floating specimen if desired. Overall it is undemanding and will grow well under a variety of conditions even in low flow environments. Due to its lightly calcified branches it is not known to be very palatable to fish or invertebrates.]

This is what Algae Barn calls POM POM. This is the only seaweed that Blue Tang @ Lawn Mower Blennie Don’t mow down.

For fast growing nutrient export or nutrient recycling, in the refugium I recommend Caulerpa Paspoidies.

Marine Plants in the Aquarium

macroalgae, marine plants, caulerpa, refugium substrate, marine macroalgae for sale

www.marineplantbook.com

CAULERPA PASPALOIDES​

C. Paspaloides features palm shaped fronds that extend upward in clusters to form a symmetrical tip. Fast growing and very hardy in the marine aquarium. This particular species does not often pollute the aquarium as other Caulerpa do, which makes it a valuable addition for nutrient control. Under intense lighting it forms tight, dark green filaments that have a triangular appearance. Under most aquarium conditions however, the growth is much different and resembles individual feather shaped fronds with a light green appearance. A thick rhizome securely anchors the plant in mud and shallow turbulent environments. Because of its fine filaments it can accumulate sediment and diatom growth so it should be pruned from time to time. Simply pinching the rhizome and breaking off individual pieces is recommended.​

PS: I disagree with “does not often pollute the aquarium”.

Out of all the macros that I have grown, this is the most likely seaweed to go sexual when nitrogen limited with intense lighting and no pruning.

 

[Subsea]

Hi everyone!
Wanted to ask what would be good substitute for ChaetoGro in macroalgae tank?
I am located in Europe (Croatia) and can't get hold of Brightwells ChaetoGro nor Continuum Chaeto grow.

@Azra
For your area, google aquaponic supplies: nutrients or fetilizer.

 

[TokenReefer]

My chaeto did nothing (idle but not dying) until a) my nutrients hit a certain number/level, b) I started dosing ferrous gluconate from the drug store or c) a combination of both. I just harvested 8L from the fuge. I too was tempted by chaeto grow at one point but skipped it. I don't think there's anything special in that bottle...

 

[GARRIGA]

Marine Plants in the Aquarium

macroalgae, marine plants, caulerpa, refugium substrate, marine macroalgae for sale

www.marineplantbook.com

[A beautiful species of Gracilaria featuring rigid, flame shaped branches that form a tight symmetrical bush. It is lightly calcified so the addition of calcium is recommended. In shallow water it is often found in very large clumps covered in colonial tunicates or encrusted with epiphytic bryozoans. The coloration varies between deep crimson red to bright orange depending on the amount of light provided. It features a small holdfast that can be attached to rocks or left as a free floating specimen if desired. Overall it is undemanding and will grow well under a variety of conditions even in low flow environments. Due to its lightly calcified branches it is not known to be very palatable to fish or invertebrates.]

This is what Algae Barn calls POM POM. This is the only seaweed that Blue Tang @ Lawn Mower Blennie Don’t mow down.

For fast growing nutrient export or nutrient recycling, in the refugium I recommend Caulerpa Paspoidies.

Marine Plants in the Aquarium

macroalgae, marine plants, caulerpa, refugium substrate, marine macroalgae for sale

www.marineplantbook.com

CAULERPA PASPALOIDES​

C. Paspaloides features palm shaped fronds that extend upward in clusters to form a symmetrical tip. Fast growing and very hardy in the marine aquarium. This particular species does not often pollute the aquarium as other Caulerpa do, which makes it a valuable addition for nutrient control. Under intense lighting it forms tight, dark green filaments that have a triangular appearance. Under most aquarium conditions however, the growth is much different and resembles individual feather shaped fronds with a light green appearance. A thick rhizome securely anchors the plant in mud and shallow turbulent environments. Because of its fine filaments it can accumulate sediment and diatom growth so it should be pruned from time to time. Simply pinching the rhizome and breaking off individual pieces is recommended.​

PS: I disagree with “does not often pollute the aquarium”.

Out of all the macros that I have grown, this is the most likely seaweed to go sexual when nitrogen limited with intense lighting and no pruning.

Staying away from green. Trying to figure out how much more Pom Pom do I need to equate to Chaeto for nutrient export and CO2 removal. Mostly the latter. Have other means of resolving nutrients. Being it’s going to be a custom build. I can make the Fuge as large as needed within reason and can light it from the bottom with Eco Chic strip lights. Including the option to have top and bottom lights on opposing schedules to keep ph stabile and not add additional CO2 when lights out. CO2 my biggest and only remaining hurdle.

LFS where I’d dispose of my pruning. Although Ogo I’ve heard tangs like and something I’ve also considered but seems more fragile and wouldn’t take up calcium.

Going Triton therefore for the most part going to let it get as thick as possible which should help better utilize the available space and hoping my habit of overfeeding might keep it happy plus have always assumed that’s one way to introduce trace needed but rather foggy on that exactly and just likely erroneous assumption.

 

[Subsea]

Staying away from green. Trying to figure out how much more Pom Pom do I need to equate to Chaeto for nutrient export and CO2 removal. Mostly the latter. Have other means of resolving nutrients. Being it’s going to be a custom build. I can make the Fuge as large as needed within reason and can light it from the bottom with Eco Chic strip lights. Including the option to have top and bottom lights on opposing schedules to keep ph stabile and not add additional CO2 when lights out. CO2 my biggest and only remaining hurdle.

LFS where I’d dispose of my pruning. Although Ogo I’ve heard tangs like and something I’ve also considered but seems more fragile and wouldn’t take up calcium.

Going Triton therefore for the most part going to let it get as thick as possible which should help better utilize the available space and hoping my habit of overfeeding might keep it happy plus have always assumed that’s one way to introduce trace needed but rather foggy on that exactly and just likely erroneous assumption.

All photosynthetic organisms consume carbon dioxide and produce oxygen as a byproduct along with exudates of DOC. When lights off, algae (coral zooanthelya is an algae) consumes oxygen and produces carbon dioxide. The lethal danger here is not low pH because of high carbon dioxide; low oxygen is the silent killer. Healthy IndoPacific reefs fluctuate pH between 7.8 to 8.2

Get an intense enough light in your algae refugium to drive photosynthesis that outcompetes your corals and your nuisance algaes. Exudates of coral DOC are mostly lipids & proteins while exudates of algae are mostly carbohydrates/glucose/sugar/carbon. I favor cryptic sponges for removing DOC and feeding carbon rich detritus to energize the microbial loop. Triton Method uses high quality activated carbon for removing DOC.

 

[GARRIGA]

All photosynthetic organisms consume carbon dioxide and produce oxygen as a byproduct along with exudates of DOC. When lights off, algae (coral zooanthelya is an algae) consumes oxygen and produces carbon dioxide. The lethal danger here is not low pH because of high carbon dioxide; low oxygen is the silent killer. Healthy IndoPacific reefs fluctuate pH between 7.8 to 8.2

Get an intense enough light in your algae refugium to drive photosynthesis that outcompetes your corals and your nuisance algaes. Exudates of coral DOC are mostly lipids & proteins while exudates of algae are mostly carbohydrates/glucose/sugar/carbon. I favor cryptic sponges for removing DOC and feeding carbon rich detritus to energize the microbial loop. Triton Method uses high quality activated carbon for removing DOC.

I understand all that and just seeking how much Pom Pom equates to same efficiency from chaeto. As well as can we use F/2 with an ammonium source to answer the original question which I’ve often pondered myself. Why spend on Chaeto Grow even if it’s available vs a cheaper solution solving the same problem. This hobby expensive enough and future main display not going to be small.

 

[Subsea]

“Trying to figure out how much more Pom Pom do I need to equate to Chaeto for nutrient export and CO2 removal”

@GARRIGA
I suggest you monitor one of three things in & out of your refugium: pH, oxygen or carbon dioxide.

PS: If this is a refugium, why eliminate green macro?

PSS: If you desire fast growing red macros to recycle nutrients and feed fish, I suggest Gracilaria Tikvahiae or Gracilaria Parvispora

 

[Subsea]

Gracilaria Hayi is the only macro that survives In 75G with mature Hippo & Lawnmhwer. The first two pictures are under 10K color spectrum in 25yr mature tank. Last two pictures is 30G Caribbean mixed garden macro lagoon under equal amounts of 6K &

 

[GARRIGA]

“Trying to figure out how much more Pom Pom do I need to equate to Chaeto for nutrient export and CO2 removal”

@GARRIGA
I suggest you monitor one of three things in & out of your refugium: pH, oxygen or carbon dioxide.

PS: If this is a refugium, why eliminate green macro?

PSS: If you desire fast growing red macros to recycle nutrients and feed fish, I suggest Gracilaria Tikvahiae or Gracilaria Parvispora

Have an oxygen meter and ph probe but how does one test CO2? Only method I know is affect on ph.

Refugium might be seen based on how I do my final design. Just don’t like green. Including in corals. Like the structure of Pom Pom. Ogo a second option. No clue on Tikvahiae or where to obtain but based just searching it not a fan of its looks.

Im also leaning Gracilaria from the understanding it won’t go sexual. If the Fuge does end up in the back as an AIO then Chaeto the best option although Ulva seems to be the most efficient and apparently keeping it lit 24/7 keeps it from going sexual. Might also just drop Ogo in it. Haven’t decided. Just gathering knowledge. I have time to make final plans.

 

[Subsea]

Let’s talk chemistry not the color of macro.

During photosynthesis, algae consumes carbon dioxide with oxygen as a byproduct. If when your display tank lights are off, oxygen drops at the same time as falling pH. Measure the oxygen of the water in and out of the refugium. If that oxygen gain is less than the oxygen loss in & out of the display tank, then you need more light intensity in the refugium.

 

[GARRIGA]

Let’s talk chemistry not the color of macro.

During photosynthesis, algae consumes carbon dioxide with oxygen as a byproduct. If when your display tank lights are off, oxygen drops at the same time as falling pH. Measure the oxygen of the water in and out of the refugium. If that oxygen gain is less than the oxygen loss in & out of the display tank, then you need more light intensity in the refugium.

Wasn't trying to fine tune the light intensity. Just thought you were implying there was a probe that could test CO2. I'm not the type to take these types of measurements and will just likely run opposing light schedules split over 12 hours or ran 24/7 with a solenoid to shut them off if ph rises too far regardless if split 12 or 24/7.

My only search now being how much Pom Pom needed to match the performance of chaeto and is there an alternative to Chaeto Grow which was the original intent of this thread we've high jacked, inadvertently. Perhaps just focus on the replacement of Chaeto Grow.

 

[Subsea]

I use F2 at double dose to grow phytoplankton.

I use liquid seaweed concentrate to grow macro algae & coral.

I dose ammonia in all systems, as required.

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[Subsea]

I don't know... Fish poop always seems to work for me. A lot of that stuff is just snake oil. I grow pom pom macro and feed it back to my tangs.

If Pom Pom macro is Gracilaria Hayi then both Ross Kronwetter (diver/owner of GulfCoast EcoSystems) & I say, Gracilaria Hayi is lightly calcified and not readily palpable to herbivores.

Marine Plants in the Aquarium

macroalgae, marine plants, caulerpa, refugium substrate, marine macroalgae for sale

www.marineplantbook.com

A beautiful species of Gracilaria featuring rigid, flame shaped branches that form a tight symmetrical bush. It is lightly calcified so the addition of calcium is recommended. In shallow water it is often found in very large clumps covered in colonial tunicates or encrusted with epiphytic bryozoans. The coloration varies between deep crimson red to bright orange depending on the amount of light provided. It features a small holdfast that can be attached to rocks or left as a free floating specimen if desired. Overall it is undemanding and will grow well under a variety of conditions even in low flow environments. Due to its lightly calcified branches it is not known to be very palatable to fish or invertebrates.​
PS: Gracilaria Hayi is the only macro algae that lawnmower & Hippo allow in this 75G display.