Super annoyed

[HairyGary]

Just venting I guess. So I am on day 85 of being fallow in my DT. I have had two wrasses in Qt for 60 days. They went through 2 rounds of prazi and then TTM and now have been eating like pigs for over a month with no signs of anything. I come home to prepare to move them to my DT tonight and notice my Lineatus twitching a couple times, yawning a couple times and now scratching twice in the past hour. Plus just noticed my Pintail twitch.
So do I do another 2 doses of Prazi ?

The most annoying part is that I have To find Room now for three incoming wrasses now that these two are not moving.

I am guessing flukes. There is No sign of velvet or ich.

So annoyed.

 

[Flippers4pups]

Just venting I guess. So I am on day 85 of being fallow in my DT. I have had two wrasses in Qt for 60 days. They went through 2 rounds of prazi and then TTM and now have been eating like pigs for over a month with no signs of anything. I come home to prepare to move them to my DT tonight and notice my Lineatus twitching a couple times, yawning a couple times and now scratching twice in the past hour. Plus just noticed my Pintail twitch.
So do I do another 2 doses of Prazi ?

The most annoying part is that I have To find Room now for three incoming wrasses now that these two are not moving.

I am guessing flukes. There is No sign of velvet or ich.

So annoyed.

@eatbreakfast, what do you think?

 

[cmcoker]

Several accounts of prazi resistant flukes lately, i think @Humblefish said he has had to use formalin. Hyposalinity is another option iirc

 

[HotRocks]

Yep few accounts of prazi resistant strain. I'd go hypo, if that doesn't cut it. Break out the formalin. Just be careful if you have to result to formalin. It is a known carcinogen. Face mask, saftey glasses, gloves etc.

@dwwataz

 

[HairyGary]

[QUOTE

Several accounts of prazi resistant flukes lately, i think @Humblefish said he has had to use formalin. Hyposalinity is another option iirc

Yep few accounts of prazi resistant strain. I'd go hypo, if that doesn't cut it. Break out the formalin. Just be careful if you have to result to formalin. It is a known carcinogen. Face mask, saftey glasses, gloves etc.

@dwwataz

Thanks. I’ll start dropping salinity slowly. How long? I am reading 2-5 days at 1.011 for juv and sdult flukes. And I guess hunt down some formalin but do not want to use it.

What about Ruby Reef Rally?

 

[HairyGary]

Thinking about removing the biomedia but leaving the sponge and then adding Ruby Reef Rally to the 20 gallon QT they are in. I've only given a bath of Rally after the initial onset of velvet at the beginning of the year. Anybody have success with Rally removing stubborn flukes?

 

[Toofattofish]

Why can't they be treated with albendazole or a derivative since it is effective against a wide variety of helminths?

 

[HairyGary]

Why can't they be treated with albendazole or a derivative since it is effective against a wide variety of helminths?

Not familiar with it.

Trying to decide if I should give Rally bath or just add per instructions to 20 gallon QT they have been in for a while now.

@Humblefish @Big G @HotRocks ?

 

[Humblefish]

I'd give one of the fish that are twitching a 5 min FW dip to check for flukes: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/freshwater-dip.248898/

If no flukes show, you might be dealing with velvet instead.

 

[HairyGary]

I'd give one of the fish that are twitching a 5 min FW dip to check for flukes: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/freshwater-dip.248898/

If no flukes show, you might be dealing with velvet instead.

ok. I'll dip this evening. Any advice if I see flukes? Obviously Prazi did not work but that was about 2 mos ago. I was thinking about Rally.

If its velvet I am going to flip as they have had no signs of it at all for over 2 mos in QT while my DT has been fallow because of velvet! ug.

Thanks!

 

[Toofattofish]

Not familiar with it.

Trying to decide if I should give Rally bath or just add per instructions to 20 gallon QT they have been in for a while now.

@Humblefish @Big G @HotRocks ?

Sorry, I meant they kill flukes in human infections. I'd imagine they'd be useful in fish too. I'm wondering if anyone has tried them.
I'd imagine it's better than formalin, which is extremely noxious and carcinogenic.

 

[HotRocks]

ok. I'll dip this evening. Any advice if I see flukes? Obviously Prazi did not work but that was about 2 mos ago. I was thinking about Rally.

If its velvet I am going to flip as they have had no signs of it at all for over 2 mos in QT while my DT has been fallow because of velvet! ug.

Thanks!

Velvet is totally possible with wrasse, they have a very thick mucus layer. TTM that you performed will not eradicate them of velvet if it is present. They would have to go through copper treatment.
Wrasse typically (Not Always) don't show the visual symptoms of Velvet.

 

[Humblefish]

ok. I'll dip this evening. Any advice if I see flukes? Obviously Prazi did not work but that was about 2 mos ago. I was thinking about Rally.

If its velvet I am going to flip as they have had no signs of it at all for over 2 mos in QT while my DT has been fallow because of velvet! ug.

Thanks!

Alternative treatments for flukes include: Hyposalinity & Formalin

 

[HairyGary]

Velvet is totally possible with wrasse, they have a very thick mucus layer. TTM that you performed will not eradicate them of velvet if it is present. They would have to go through copper treatment.
Wrasse typically (Not Always) don't show the visual symptoms of Velvet.

Yeah I prefer to QT without copper with wrasses if possible but did not think it was possible for velvet to lay dorment in two wrasses in same QT tank for over 2 mos. I can understand maybe a single wrasse. This may change my mind if in fact it is not flukes.

 

[HairyGary]

Alternative treatments for flukes include: Hyposalinity & Formalin

I'd prefer to stay away from Formalin. With Hypo and flukes is it a full 30 days or is it 2-5?

 

[HotRocks]

Yeah I prefer to QT without copper with wrasses if possible but did not think it was possible for velvet to lay dorment in two wrasses in same QT tank for over 2 mos. I can understand maybe a single wrasse. This may change my mind if in fact it is not flukes.

@4FordFamily managed to keep several wrasse in a tank for +/-6mos with velvet present (It was a wrasse only tank). Till eventually disaster struck.

I can make a suggestion if you decide you are dealing with velvet opposed to flukes.
Purchase a Hanna High Range Copper Checker, and copper power.
I have had good luck so far since the discovery of the checker. It provides a "very accurate" digital reading. We are able to treat and monitor the Cu level like never before. I am currently treating wrasse at 1.75ppm using copper power and they have done very well in copper.

 

[HairyGary]

@4FordFamily managed to keep several wrasse in a tank for +/-6mos with velvet present (It was a wrasse only tank). Till eventually disaster struck.

I can make a suggestion if you decide you are dealing with velvet opposed to flukes.
Purchase a Hanna High Range Copper Checker, and copper power.
I have had good luck so far since the discovery of the checker. It provides a "very accurate" digital reading. We are able to treat and monitor the Cu level like never before. I am currently treating wrasse at 1.75ppm using copper power and they have done very well in copper.

Thanks! I lost 7 wrasse in the late February/early march outbreak. I think one might of had it for a bit. But now...oof. To think I was literally 30 minutes away from netting them to place in the DT. Anyway, if I dont see any flukes fall off tonight or am unsure, I may just treat with copper power and will order Hanna. How long at 1.75ppm - I assume that is therapeutic? I have another little flasher that went through prazi and TTM but has been separate from these guys. Wondering if I should just treat him as well.

So frustrating.

 

[HotRocks]

Thanks! I lost 7 wrasse in the late February/early march outbreak. I think one might of had it for a bit. But now...oof. To think I was literally 30 minutes away from netting them to place in the DT. Anyway, if I dont see any flukes fall off tonight or am unsure, I may just treat with copper power and will order Hanna. How long at 1.75ppm - I assume that is therapeutic? I have another little flasher that went through prazi and TTM but has been separate from these guys. Wondering if I should just treat him as well.

So frustrating.

Therapuetic minimum for chelated copper (copper power) is 1.5ppm.

I have been treating at 1.75ppm to make sure that level does not drop below 1.5ppm. 1.75ppm is also safely below the level of toxicity (which varies depending on the fish).

30 day treatment is recommended, unless you transfer them to a 2nd completely sterile QT at the 14 day mark.

I personally would treat all of them together (if you aren't dealing with flukes). That's your decision. I am not a "chance taker". I have way too many hard to keep fish that I (and others) have worked butts off to maintian a disease free environment for them.

I am pretty sure @Humblefish is using the 1.75ppm for 14 days protocol then a transfer to sterile QT.

 

[HairyGary]

Therapuetic minimum for chelated copper (copper power) is 1.5ppm.

I have been treating at 1.75ppm to make sure that level does not drop below 1.5ppm. 1.75ppm is also safely below the level of toxicity (which varies depending on the fish).

30 day treatment is recommended, unless you transfer them to a 2nd completely sterile QT at the 14 day mark.

I personally would treat all of them together (if you aren't dealing with flukes). That's your decision. I am not a "chance taker". I have way too many hard to keep fish that I (and others) have worked butts off to maintian a disease free environment for them.

I am pretty sure @Humblefish is using the 1.75ppm for 14 days protocol then a transfer to sterile QT.

Thanks alot! I read your newer write up. Nice work.

Yeah I will probably add the little diamond flasher to the two big fairies in the 20 gallon given I have a bio base already established and treat there for 14 days and then move to sterile tank regardless of what I find tonight in a a dip. Good thing I go on vacation in 17 days.

I plan to change my QT protocol based on this situation - Prazi and observation, and then copper power for 14 days.

 

[HotRocks]

Thanks alot! I read your newer write up. Nice work.

Yeah I will probably add the little diamond flasher to the two big fairies in the 20 gallon given I have a bio base already established and treat there for 14 days and then move to sterile tank regardless of what I find tonight in a a dip. Good thing I go on vacation in 17 days.

I plan to change my QT protocol based on this situation - Prazi and observation, and then copper power for 14 days.

There were plenty of people here at R2R that played a large part in all of that!

I do spend 5-7 days ramping up the copper as well. Especially with wrasse. (Hopefully this still works with your vacation plans). I think it's a critical part of the success seen using the Hanna copper power combo!