The DSR Method (Dutch Synthetic Reefing)

Matevz Savarin · Mar 18, 2019

Very clean setup just for me. I dont have any room left.. I ll remove 2 reactors and refugium, one is bio bellet reactor witch is allways off.. and one is algea reactor...
Ok, one question if dosing vodka, bacterias also removes phosphates so I ll have to dose more phosphates to compensate that...as mentioned I am a little sceptical because my no3 and po4 are perfect.. but ok I will do it!
I am doing DSR after all

glennf · Mar 18, 2019

Matevz Savarin said:
Very clean setup just for me. I dont have any room left.. I ll remove 2 reactors and refugium, one is bio bellet reactor witch is allways off.. and one is algea reactor...
Ok, one question if dosing vodka, bacterias also removes phosphates so I ll have to dose more phosphates to compensate that...as mentioned I am a little sceptical because my no3 and po4 are perfect.. but ok I will do it!
I am doing DSR after all

I myself have no experience with vodka nor methanol. I choosed to go the Vinegar/sugar way.

Matevz Savarin · Mar 18, 2019

Ok so I ll go vinegar/ sugar no problem with that...

tnx Mr.Glennf.

Matevz Savarin · Mar 18, 2019

I will understand if you wont tell me whats mix ratio of 5% vinegar and sugar?

glennf · Mar 19, 2019

Matevz Savarin said:
I will understand if you wont tell me whats mix ratio of 5% vinegar and sugar?

I can tell you this . I use much higher concentrate of acetic acid.
But the mixing ratio is a secret. There are to many suppliers downstream who are relying on my discreetness on these matters.

We must trust on the supply chain to have a flourishing hobby. That's what i am working on.
No LFS means no hobby.

The quality of Dutch LFS are becomming better and better. Those who don't cleanup their act wil be gone in no time. No more dead and browned out corals are tolerated in shops. Because the difference between the once who are knowledgeable and the ones who aren't are showing.

Matevz Savarin · Mar 19, 2019

I totally agree with you... I will buy carbon v/s as soon I will have need to buy some other stuff from seaflower...but for now I mixed 9% vinegar with rodi to get 5%( usa seam they have only 5% we only have 9%) And good thing is that we allways have it in our house for eating salats ( dont ask) , cleaning, etc.. multipurpose liquid

) and I added 4 small tbs of sugar in 400ml liquid... hope its good

for now.
My fear is that nitrates wont go too low not too high.. so I will be slowly dosing by dsr carbon calculator and measure no3..
And my sump is looking cleaner, then before.. with refugium and leds, and reactor and leds..

glennf · Mar 19, 2019

Matevz Savarin said:
I totally agree with you... I will buy carbon v/s as soon I will have need to buy some other stuff from seaflower...but for now I mixed 9% vinegar with rodi to get 5%( usa seam they have only 5% we only have 9%) And good thing is that we allways have it in our house for eating salats ( dont ask) , cleaning, etc.. multipurpose liquid ) and I added 4 small tbs of sugar in 400ml liquid... hope its good for now.
My fear is that nitrates wont go too low not too high.. so I will be slowly dosing by dsr carbon calculator and measure no3..
And my sump is looking cleaner, then before.. with refugium and leds, and reactor and leds..

I understand you too, shippingcost can be killing
The ingredients are there, you just need to finetune yourself.
The method is there to show that very nice results can be archieved. NO more annoying WC.

The product are there to homologise and support the reefing community and downstream supply chain.

Matevz Savarin · Mar 19, 2019

Now I am thinking and realized this.. since I am adding po4, refugium allmost stoped growing , so there was no acess food for it... so why am I adding carbon if I dont need it at this moment to lower my no3? Maybee just to compensate lost of refugium...? Maybee soon I will have to add 2xno3 to raise no3 to 2.5ppm? Or I am making no sense hire...

glennf · Mar 21, 2019

Matevz Savarin said:
Now I am thinking and realized this.. since I am adding po4, refugium allmost stoped growing , so there was no acess food for it... so why am I adding carbon if I dont need it at this moment to lower my no3? Maybee just to compensate lost of refugium...? Maybee soon I will have to add 2xno3 to raise no3 to 2.5ppm? Or I am making no sense hire...

The algae in a refugium need po4/no3 + trace elements to grow.
When this is deficient they die and release it again. So when your system is completely deficient the algae won't grow back and you need to place new one. I often see that happen.
Algae need maintenance too. feeding when deficient, cutting when flourishing.

Carbon dosing increased the bacteria which uses po4/no3 to grow. The acces bacteria becomes food for corals and other organisms, get skimmed off, or exported with the PF.

So to prevent population therefore PO4/NO3 to bounce up and down we keep the carbon dosing consitent. Find the sweetspot for nominal dosings ussualy between d3-d5.

It's a lot easier to add NO3 and PO4 for small and quick corrections than removing them.

Carbon dosing is the long time stability of a DSR system.

Matevz Savarin · Mar 21, 2019

Mr. Glennf thank you for answear it all makes sense now, so I will dose it according to chart till it drops below 2.5ppm. And then adjust the dose to maintain 2.5ppm...

Jason mack · Mar 21, 2019

I've been dosing ez carbon to reduce my no3 and p04 ....I'm currently at the max dosing and still have not seen any reduction....my no3 50ppm...po4 0.14..
Going too do a WC today see if that helps any ...what else can I do ..do I keep adding max dose ..???

glennf · Mar 21, 2019

Matevz Savarin said:
Mr. Glennf thank you for answear it all makes sense now, so I will dose it according to chart till it drops below 2.5ppm. And then adjust the dose to maintain 2.5ppm...

Precisely

PO4 range 0,04-0,08
NO3 range 0,5- 5 is easy to tune in and just fine for a while range of corals species.
Tune lower for low zooxathelle and brighter colors, if you overshot and stay to low colors will washout and become pale.
Tune higher for more vivid and deeper accents.

Matevz Savarin · Mar 21, 2019

What about my dosing of po4, will this change with carbon v/s? Po4 is spot on like I like it- from 13-24 on hanna. So if bacterias will multiply I will need to add more po4? I think it makes sense..I will just measure it and see

greetigs from Slovenia!

glennf · Mar 21, 2019

Jason mack said:
I've been dosing ez carbon to reduce my no3 and p04 ....I'm currently at the max dosing and still have not seen any reduction....my no3 50ppm...po4 0.14..
Going too do a WC today see if that helps any ...what else can I do ..do I keep adding max dose ..???

How long have you been dosing?
What is you tank netto volume?
How much ml are your dosings?
Daily?

Jason mack · Mar 21, 2019

I've been dosing 20 days or more now ...tank is 300ltrs ...been dosing 37.5 ml per day ...for maybe 3-4 days now ...

Matevz Savarin · Mar 21, 2019

6 weeks 2ml daily my own kh2po4 solution. 2.2g pure staff in 500 ml rodi..
So its daily dose 0.06 ppm.. and its all consumed in 24 hours. Its 350 neto tank...Since I am dosing po4 stn on milka has stoped completly

and all corals regain colors and growing but this is mostly because of trace ez...

glennf · Mar 21, 2019

Jason mack said:
I've been dosing 20 days or more now ...tank is 300ltrs ...been dosing 37.5 ml per day ...for maybe 3-4 days now ...

Yes.. your are on max dosing.
Keep dosing steady, do not cross max dosing.
Sometimes it may take a while to get the system to go your way.
If you feel confident in waterchanges please do so.
To realy make a difference do a 50% WC.
This may just trip over the balance to make the system work in your favour. Once you gain control you may gradually ommit the changes.

Have you evaluated the setup using these criteria:
When there fundamental problems the need to be eleminated step by step.
http://www.DSRreefing.com/nutrients

glennf · Mar 21, 2019

Matevz Savarin said:
6 weeks 2ml daily my own kh2po4 solution. 2.2g pure staff in 500 ml rodi..
So its daily dose 0.06 ppm.. and its all consumed in 24 hours. Its 350 neto tank...Since I am dosing po4 stn on milka has stoped completly and all corals regain colors and growing but this is mostly because of trace ez...

It's the total package that make the difference.
You're gaining control now. it's a wonderfull experience.