Toddlers climbing aquariums, will it tip?

[redfishbluefish]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you wish to tether your tank/stand to the wall, it will need to hold back over 1000 pounds. I would think this would take large chains that attached with bolts that go though the wall, attached with steel plates. This assumes the kid uses mechanical advantage to tip the tank (i.e., hanging on an open door).

However, as mentioned earlier, I don't believe it's an issue....without ingenious mechanical advantage.

 

[DSC reef]

@BigJohnny I like the idea of teathering the tank. I mounted our old RODI holding tank to the wall in our old house. Even though that room was off limits toddlers are fast and clever.

 

[CJS80]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you wish to tether your tank/stand to the wall, it will need to hold back over 1000 pounds. I would think this would take large chains that attached with bolts that go though the wall, attached with steel plates. This assumes the kid uses mechanical advantage to tip the tank (i.e., hanging on an open door).

No you would have to overcome the force of the tethers (if attached correctly) before you would get the extra weight if it started to tip.

 

[Brew12]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you wish to tether your tank/stand to the wall, it will need to hold back over 1000 pounds.

The tethers would be additive. If my calculation of 146 pounds exerted straight at the top is correct, and a tether is added that would could hold 100 pounds, it would then take 246 pounds to start tipping the tank.

 

[redfishbluefish]

The tethers would be additive. If my calculation of 146 pounds exerted straight at the top is correct, and a tether is added that would could hold 100 pounds, it would then take 246 pounds to start tipping the tank.

Got it! My little mind is thinking the tip is already in progress, and that's why I'm thinking chains. You're saying stop the tip before it begins.

 

[mibwb]

If anyone has a large TV. If you read the instructions...most say to tether or use a brace to attach it to a wall brace or braces to avoid accidental fall. The main idea is to prevent accidental fall. No one can predict when an accident (that's why the unexpected or unintended is called an accident) will happen. Your aquarium shouldn't tip over or fall if pulled on because of the weight? That's assuming everything is perfect in it's set up. Floors level? Stand level with full tank on it? Floor joints new or been braced and tested to hold the weight? Does the tank move any when someone walks by? House done settling? Does the house shake when a huge truck passes by on the street? Any furniture near by could accidentally fall against the tank and make it fall? Any Elderly that could fall against it with their body or hit it with a walker or wheelchair? My elderly Mother with Alzheimer has done this among other things. Have you taught your kids not to touch it or climb on it or lean or push on it? What about the actions of other peoples Children or other Adults? What about a large dog jumping at the tank? Or is there a rug on the floor someone could trip on and land against the tank? That's just some stuff to take into consideration. Would you leave medicine laying around because it's in a childproof bottle? No, you wouldn't. You'd put it some where safe. There really is nothing 100% childproof or 100% foolproof. I can tell you this because I've been around a lot of kids and Fools that prove it. I have some scars to prove it too. Well, we all don't have a lockable fish room. Most people have their tank(s) out in living areas to enjoy them. I use L braces to attach stands to the wall stud. I even have screwed stands to the floor with a brace when I couldn't use a brace in the wall. I put aquarium meds and chemicals in a keyed locked area. Those magnet locks are fine until your kids find out a magnet from off the fridge will work too. My Nephew found this out and that his toys will float in the tanks too. Lids were a must around him...until he started opening them. I hope my rambling helps anyone who might not have thought things thru. Prevention is better than the alternative.

 

[PhreeByrd]

It's the shearing force on a screw that's the problem, not pull out force. That's why you can't use screws to build beams, trusses, attach hurricane clips, and many other structural components. It's quite easy to shear a screw.

In the situation described, there is no shear force on the screw holding the tether to the wall.
Unless the floor collapses, of course.
Now, for the attachment to the stand, assuming the tether attaching screw is driven into the side of the stand, are we talking about the shear strength of the wood and the screw or of the screw itself? The shear strength of the (typical, #8) screw itself is approximately double the 80# load. The shear strength of the wood is less, but without knowing the construction of the stand, it's not possible (or wise) to estimate.

 

[Myka]

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[made2rock]

To start with you 1,000 pounds pushing that stand into the floor. So to tip it over you need to apply enough force to lift one side of it high enough to go over. So if we simplify it 1,000 pounds that's 500 in the front and 500 in back. So you 25 lbs kid (when wet) is going to have to move around 500 high enough to shift the weight AWAY from the wall. so if the tank is 24" front to back that will be about 12". So you better start feeding that kid some Wheaties. On the other hand if mama ain't happy ain't no one happy so yep you should do something to make her happy. Just use any bracket to the wall. Use a big long screw for show and she'll be happy and the kid will be safe.

I never had a problem but I did have a 5 year old get a hold of some Mentholatum blue. His whole mouth was blue, talk about freaking out. I was in the air force, flew thru the gate to the ER. Rushed the kid cops were also after me. The doctor laughed and said it is also a die they use in doing some tests and it won't hurt him at all.

 

[srad750c]

I wouldn't take the chance, Murphy's Law. Plus over time it may weaken the seals on you front glass panel? I don't play with water, kids and electricity, bad combination.

 

[srad750c]

To calculate the force needed to pull this down on top of herself, the math works like this. This is a Tipping Moment equation. Top heavy or bottom heavy doesn't impact the tipping force required. It does impact how far it needs to tip before it continues to tip on its own. I am going to convert all of the measurements to metric since that is what I normally work with. Assuming around 1000lb total weight pushing at very top edge of aquarium.

Force * the height the force is applied at = mass * distance from center of gravity

Force * (1.62m) = (4400n) * (0.24m) = 651n or 146 pounds of force. Odds are your aquarium is heavier so you can consider this a worst case.

T

Greybeard has it basically correct. You're looking at an overturning moment though, not torque. It's force x offset to point of overturning, forces passing through the overturning point do not contribute to overturning. Meaning you could apply downward force to the front face of the tank, and nothing happens until the tank or stand fail from the stress being applied.

Assuming the front of the tank is the point of rotation, you'd have:

1000# acting down, at 0.75' horizontal offset from the front of the tank
Y# acting down, 0.25' from the tank - on the 3" lip on the stand, assuming a kid is hanging from the stand directly. 48.5" stand leaves 0.25' on each side of the tank.

To solve for Y:
1000# x 0.75' = Y# x 0.25' - right side of the equation is trying to rotate the tank, left is resisting. To overturn, you need "Y" to be large enough for the right side to be bigger than the left.

Y > 3000# to rotate the tank. (750 #-FT/0.25 FT)

Extend the moment arm to 16" (1.3') for hanging on a cabinet door as Greybeard suggests, and Y > 576#

Let's go a bit further, and assume a 50# toddler. What does the moment arm need to be to flip the tank?
(1000# x 0.75')/50# = 15'.

A 200# adult, body weight only? 3.75'

If you tried to flip the stand in a fit of rage?
750#-ft/1.5ft => Needing to apply over 500# of force.

It all seems very implausible to me that a child, or even adult, would flip a full 90g tank by hanging on the stand or the tank.

Push down on the front of the stand with your body weight, I'm sure you already know without math the tank won't go anywhere. Maybe a show of physics in action will make the wife feel better.

Edit: Post above me went up while I posting this, we have some different answers, I'm confident in mine, but our conclusions are the same.

This doesn't account for the momentum of the wave action if tank rocks enough. Way too many factors to consider.
Add wave action, from the rocking of tank, I drove tanker trucks for a while, even with baffles in tank there is momentum involved, even from just taking off and stopping immediately for a brake test. I would just not allow kid to be doing that.

 

[BigJohnny]

No one is actually allowing a kid to climb an aquarium, and no kids are climbing aquariums (at least mine isnt) it was a hypothetical if you read the first post. Thanks