Vibrant Poll

[john.m.cole3]

Hello everybody! Are you having a good start to the weekend? That's great! Do you use Vibrant? I do to. I really really like this product. It is clearing up my hair algae problem and I'm waiting for it to take out a few spots of bubble algae. As I read through the discussion thread created by @UWC, I notice that some users are experiencing what seems to be a cyanobacteria outbreak. The thought has been proposed that this may be due to the Vibrant breaking algae down, having the phosphates released back into the tank before they can be exported, causing a nutrient imbalance where PO4 is higher than NO3, and then cyano.

The point of this thread isn't to bash Vibrant at all. Quite the opposite. We're looking for solutions to the issues that may have risen so that way no user is anxious about starting the use of Vibrant. Please vote and comment below what dose number you are on and if you have been testing for NO3 and PO4, please include your test results.

This is not a thread to start arguments but a source of information to assist Vibrant users. Any negativity will not be tolerated. Thank you to everyone who participates!

 

[twilliard]

Cyanobacteria is HIGHLY misunderstood by today's reefkeepers so you may find uninformed information being posted by posters.

 

[nervousmonkey]

Cyanobacteria is HIGHLY misunderstood by today's reefkeepers so you may find uninformed information being posted by posters.

Great point Todd, and I think the main reason for this poll. I am experiencing cyano growth and have used almost 8 oz. of Vibrant, but as UWC states, it is now getting rid of the cyano, just took it getting a foot hold in the tank I am dosing on, and then the rest of the Vibrant to knock it back down. I am a firm believer in Vibrant, it really does everything that the product marketers stated.

I would like to know why some people report cyano outbreaks after a period of time though, and personally don't want the attribution of cyano appearing in one's tank to be:
1. "Oh, make sure not to use air fresheners in your house, that causes cyano.", because, as we all know, Glade has always included cyano spores on their list of ingredients.
2. "You must have candles in the house, I heard that causes cyano." because candle wax, you know, cyano spores, it's obvious now right? to the third potentially unexplainable kind of tank magic to occur out of thin air:
3. "Oh, that's because you are dosing Vibrant", technically in my case this is true, but I can't just say this without sounding quite uninformed and frankly, stupid.

I am just being stupid in the above examples exactly because I do not know enough about cyano to post intelligently. Seriously. What I need to know about cyano is all contained in your brain my friend. Would you help direct me to where I can learn more? Besides Google, because that's why I'm here, right?

Honestly, would you explain the basics of cyano and it's origination to us?

 

[jsker]

I have cyano and have had red cyano in my system. I am usings vibrant to try to red the red cyano once and for all and then use a maintenance dose to keep the cyano out of the system. So far my tank look much better, and I will admit that I have stepped up my cleaning of the substrate. filters socks and skimmer more often

Thank you @john.m.cole3 for taking to lead in putting together a poll

 

[jsker]

Great point Todd, and I think the main reason for this poll. I am experiencing cyano growth and have used almost 8 oz. of Vibrant, but as UWC states, it is now getting rid of the cyano, just took it getting a foot hold in the tank I am dosing on, and then the rest of the Vibrant to knock it back down. I am a firm believer in Vibrant, it really does everything that the product marketers stated.

I would like to know why some people report cyano outbreaks after a period of time though, and personally don't want the attribution of cyano appearing in one's tank to be:
1. "Oh, make sure not to use air fresheners in your house, that causes cyano.", because, as well all know, Glade has always included cyano spores on their list of ingredients.
2. "You must have candles in the house, I heard that causes cyano." because candle wax, you know, cyano spores, it's obvious now right? to the third potentially unexplainable kind of tank magic to occur out of thin air:
3. "Oh, that's because you are dosing Vibrant", technically in my case this is true, but I can't just say this without sounding quite uninformed and frankly, stupid.

I am just being stupid in the above examples exactly because I do not know enough about cyano to post intelligently. Seriously. What I need to know about cyano is all contained in your brain my friend. Would you help direct me to where I can learn more? Besides Google, because that's why I'm here, right?

Honestly, would you explain the basics of cyano and it's origination to us?

Hey did not know that cyano spores where in air fresheners. Thank you for the information.

 

[StrangeDejavu]

Quite the opposite for me. Spirulina had just popped up on the sandbed when I started Vibrant, and I haven't seen it since. My Dad's tank, which has never seen a spot of cyano in the year it's been set up, suddenly broke out with spirulina when he started Vibrant. He's way more lax than me on tank maintenance, water changes and general husbandry. He also has no nutrient export aside from water changes.

 

[twilliard]

Great point Todd, and I think the main reason for this poll. I am experiencing cyano growth and have used almost 8 oz. of Vibrant, but as UWC states, it is now getting rid of the cyano, just took it getting a foot hold in the tank I am dosing on, and then the rest of the Vibrant to knock it back down. I am a firm believer in Vibrant, it really does everything that the product marketers stated.

I would like to know why some people report cyano outbreaks after a period of time though, and personally don't want the attribution of cyano appearing in one's tank to be:
1. "Oh, make sure not to use air fresheners in your house, that causes cyano.", because, as well all know, Glade has always included cyano spores on their list of ingredients.
2. "You must have candles in the house, I heard that causes cyano." because candle wax, you know, cyano spores, it's obvious now right? to the third potentially unexplainable kind of tank magic to occur out of thin air:
3. "Oh, that's because you are dosing Vibrant", technically in my case this is true, but I can't just say this without sounding quite uninformed and frankly, stupid.

I am just being stupid in the above examples exactly because I do not know enough about cyano to post intelligently. Seriously. What I need to know about cyano is all contained in your brain my friend. Would you help direct me to where I can learn more? Besides Google, because that's why I'm here, right?

Honestly, would you explain the basics of cyano and it's origination to us?

Countless hours of microscopy work, reading, trial and error, observation and interaction is hard to put in one page
There is one thing I would like to point out. There is a difference between the statement "out competes" and "kills".
Thank John for this poll. I will not be active in this poll as I am not introducing this into my tank. My Vibrant "should" be here today, was supposed to be here yesterday.
Once I get this product in hand I will make this priority in my lab.

 

[twilliard]

Here you go guys with microscopes keeping track of the bacteria in your tank
http://greenwaterlab.com/algal-id.html

 

[nervousmonkey]

Countless hours of microscopy work, reading, trial and error, observation and interaction is hard to put in one page
There is one thing I would like to point out. There is a difference between the statement "out competes" and "kills".
Thank John for this poll. I will not be active in this one. My Vibrant "should" be here today, was supposed to be here yesterday.
Once I get this product in hand I will make this priority in my lab.

Although I know you won't be active as in giving us results from your tank, which I think you should anyway once you start dosing Vibrant. Reason being is that the stuff starts to work quickly. @john.m.cole3 aren't you on dose 4 and @jsker dose 5 with the results you are both having? I am almost out of a bottle and didn't see cyano until the bottle was almost empty. Frankly I thought I was just maintenance dosing at that point, no algae left anyway.

Here you go guys with microscopes keeping track of the bacteria in your tank
http://greenwaterlab.com/algal-id.html

Thanks for the link Todd!!! I hope you stay active here man. It would be super cool to see your results. Now that I have been through this once with Vibrant, I would change the way I dosed, measured, looked at and even breathed on that tank. That stuff is sort of magic, wish I knew more about what was happening on a cellular level in the tank to make it work... Say that I actually had a microscope as good as yours... Wow what a difference this thread could be!

 

[twilliard]

Oh just as an FYI for this thread Vibrant is NOT going into my system. This will all be lab testing

 

[nervousmonkey]

Oh, hmm, well that changes things, but only a little.

Still wondering the causal relationship between Vibrant and cyano or if that is all just an old wives tale. Did I just call myself an old wife? :mad_O

 

[twilliard]

through lab testing I will be able to answer that question

 

[john.m.cole3]

through lab testing I will be able to answer that question

@twilliard where will you be posting your findings?

 

[Chris Adams]

I have not had cyano in years and within a few weeks after dosing I started seeing cyano on 1 of my cyphastrea rocks. Now overall I have been real happy with results in both tanks.

1 thing I will mention is the tank that developed some cyano (not both tanks) was the tank I did very few water changes on the last year plus. Vibrant took care of the hair algae and bryopsis almost completely. I will utilize vibrant on needed basis. Overall give Vibrant a thumbs up.

PS Chaeto in both tanks gone so that is a bummer but I should have pulled some before starting.

 

[twilliard]

@twilliard where will you be posting your findings?

I am not sure. I have been tossing this around for the last week thinking on how I will write this up.
Possibly here with your permission but this is a poll thread.
This is a great thread as it is based on cyanobacteria. The only problem is people will not know what bacterium they are dealing with as each one has a different trigger.

 

[blkhwkz]

I have used Vibrant in 2 of my tanks, neither had cyano before I started dosing, both do now. The one tank I can definitely believe it is because the hair algae and stuff was breaking down faster than it could be exported. My newer tank has an oversized skimmer, is currently fallow due to an ich outbreak, and I have to dose nitrates to keep them above 0 (even before it went fallow.) Phosphates in that tank are usually under .05. Normally .02-.03 (Hanna ULR.) I have not tested in a week or so (which is when it went fallow,) but I will be today after I get done mounting some frags in there. So it is completely possible that tank is now having higher phosphates than nitrates. That tank is also only a little over 4 months old so I am not really worried. I also started dosing Red Sea Reef Energy A+B since it went fallow to get some nutrients to my SPS. I have been dosing very small amounts every other day so that could be a factor also.

I like Vibrant, so far the tank with GHA, while it is not gone it is much better, but I rarely ever have to clean the glass anymore on that tank. Same with the MP40 I used to have to clean it once or twice weekly, now it's maybe every 3-4 weeks.

I have a third tank having a bad cyano outbreak now, and I know why, so going to start dosing Vibrant in there and see how it goes.

 

[Waterjockey]

While I do have some heavy cyano on my sanded, I can't conclusively point to Vibrant as being the initiator. I changed my carbon dosing mix at the same time I started Vibrant. Many people report Cyano when changing or initiating carbon dosing. There is no algaes of any type left in my tank (finally removed the last of the Chaeto a few days ago)....so we will see if it starts "working" on the Cyano now.
On that note, Vibrant has kicked the crap out of my dinos and hair algae.

 

[john.m.cole3]

From the discussion thread, post #1521, UWC stated, "It's very hard to say actual dosages for cyano or any algaes really. We try to give our best rough estimates as there are so many different species and every tank is so different. In a true ulns system, around 4-5 doses where the cyano is not directly being fed by vibrant working its way through other algaes, sludge, waste, etc first. In some tanks it goes pretty quick along with other algaes, but in most cases, the cyano is the last thing to go as it is being fed while the bacteria works through the other algaes and waste in the tank. For cyano, just be patient and let it work it magic "

 

[twilliard]

From the discussion thread, post #1521, UWC stated, "It's very hard to say actual dosages for cyano or any algaes really. We try to give our best rough estimates as there are so many different species and every tank is so different. In a true ulns system, around 4-5 doses where the cyano is not directly being fed by vibrant working its way through other algaes, sludge, waste, etc first. In some tanks it goes pretty quick along with other algaes, but in most cases, the cyano is the last thing to go as it is being fed while the bacteria works through the other algaes and waste in the tank. For cyano, just be patient and let it work it magic "

Nice quote to keep up

 

[nervousmonkey]

From the discussion thread, post #1521, UWC stated, "It's very hard to say actual dosages for cyano or any algaes really. We try to give our best rough estimates as there are so many different species and every tank is so different. In a true ulns system, around 4-5 doses where the cyano is not directly being fed by vibrant working its way through other algaes, sludge, waste, etc first. In some tanks it goes pretty quick along with other algaes, but in most cases, the cyano is the last thing to go as it is being fed while the bacteria works through the other algaes and waste in the tank. For cyano, just be patient and let it work it magic "

Good, so if a person didn't pay attention to let's say, how much they dosed at a time, UWC gives some leniency then? All theoretical questions of course. It's not like said person dosed all 8 ounces in 2 weeks.