I am by no means one to offer advice, but I didn’t see PH listed in your parameters and am wondering if large fluctuations could be happening in your tank. You said you’re in a newer home so maybe CO2 buildup could be driving down your PH? Just a thought.
Watch me kill SPS...
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you mention you are in a newer home that might have higher CO2. Have you tested PH? I was having some trouble and realized my ph meter was out of calibration and ph had been dipping below 7.6 and this was making it very hard for my corals to grow. I started dosing kalkwasser to get my PH up and my coral growth is taking off.
ReeferHead47
Community Member
One problem that I see is carbon being used constantly. I wouldn’t use it more than 3-4 days at a time, place it in a reactor, and only once a month or even every two months. This will bleach Acro, first hand experience. I had similar issues when I first started with Acros. The first, and most significant change that I made, was upgrading to a BRS 7 stage RODI. My previous system was not “good enough” to remove all the contaminants from my tap water. Second, I stopped the frequent water changes and I control nutrients with 2 Santa Monica algae scrubbers and NoPox. I only use water changes to remove solids like detritus, hair algae, etc... And to balance trace elements. These changes created stability, which is super important for Acro. Later on, I had several SPS getting eaten from the base similar to yours and I noticed very small flatworms infesting the bottom of my plugs and even the frag rack. Dipping the frags in CoralRx pro for 5 minutes got rid of most of them and I soaked the rack in vinegar. Once pests like these get in to your tank you just have to manage them. When I glued them on to my rock I didn’t have any issues. Flow is another important parameter to get right but I would start with the other stuff first.
Also, if you run carbon constantly you’ll want to check your iodine level. It’s probably very low or not measurable.
Also, if you run carbon constantly you’ll want to check your iodine level. It’s probably very low or not measurable.
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Reef_in_Denver
Active Member
I'm three months into a tank with a whole slew of SPS in it. Low nutrients can really really hurt a tank. I also started running rox carbon and it was pulling too much out of my water. Dino's and cyano followed. Took it offline and started feeding a ton and it's helped significantly.
If I recall you only have one set of zoas in your tank. Why run the carbon then? I know it can help remove bad guys but it can also do *to good of a job* and pull necessary elements out of your water.
I would rather have any phos at .15 then at .0 or .01.
Just weighing in.
If I recall you only have one set of zoas in your tank. Why run the carbon then? I know it can help remove bad guys but it can also do *to good of a job* and pull necessary elements out of your water.
I would rather have any phos at .15 then at .0 or .01.
Just weighing in.
Makers Marc
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Man. I feel you bud. I'm on year 2.5 and have had similar issues. All sps die within a month. Acros get slight burnt tips, tissue thins then succumbs to algae.. all montis seem to fade and caps lighten then algae takes over.
All stable, no more than +/- 0.2dkh swings in 24 hrs (so not alk spikes) Always have no3>12 and po4 =0.07-0.15 (not low nutrients). Tests done daily for months at a time. It gets exhausting having to re-explain all your efforts, so I applaud you for posting b/c I'm sure its not easy.
I started with sterile dry pukani and nothing live. So figured mine is a bacterial issue. I've been hell bent that its my Kessel ap700s that are burning things and have been thinking about going to aquaticlife hybdrids, but it makes me feel better seeing you're getting this with t5 hybrids.
I also spent tons on 10 icp tests which I did months apart and did massive water changes bc I thought tin was the issue.
I then replaced pumps bc I saw slight rusting, etc. Its been an exhausting journey.
Anyway, I'm following bc I feel we have similar issues. You're not alone. Some of us do research and do everything experts due and shut just doesn't workout.
Oh yeah, I also finally switched salts from aquavitro salinity to tropic marine and seeing if that helps. I do have gonis and zoas and some acans/blastos doing fine. On a current batch of acros I'm testing again too..
All stable, no more than +/- 0.2dkh swings in 24 hrs (so not alk spikes) Always have no3>12 and po4 =0.07-0.15 (not low nutrients). Tests done daily for months at a time. It gets exhausting having to re-explain all your efforts, so I applaud you for posting b/c I'm sure its not easy.
I started with sterile dry pukani and nothing live. So figured mine is a bacterial issue. I've been hell bent that its my Kessel ap700s that are burning things and have been thinking about going to aquaticlife hybdrids, but it makes me feel better seeing you're getting this with t5 hybrids.
I also spent tons on 10 icp tests which I did months apart and did massive water changes bc I thought tin was the issue.
I then replaced pumps bc I saw slight rusting, etc. Its been an exhausting journey.
Anyway, I'm following bc I feel we have similar issues. You're not alone. Some of us do research and do everything experts due and shut just doesn't workout.
Oh yeah, I also finally switched salts from aquavitro salinity to tropic marine and seeing if that helps. I do have gonis and zoas and some acans/blastos doing fine. On a current batch of acros I'm testing again too..
Crashnt24
Well-Known Member
I'm in the same boat. Just burned through 3 Acro frags, the dragonfruit monti is holding up, and a 2 year acro at the top of my tank is still growing. Getting frustrated as well. I'll share anything I find on my end and hopefully we can all be successful soon
Im in the camp of getting an ICP test, I don’t read anywhere that you did one, I was having similar issues and did a test that came back with high heavy metal contamination, selenium, copper and nickel. could not figure out where the heck it was coming from, then one day as I was adding salt to my very tall water tank I happened to see the heater I had placed in it when I set it up, the wIrving had shorted and the whole unit had fallen down to the bottom of the tank and stayed there for months rotting, until I happened to spot it. been in there so long the black rubber cord was deteriorating, bad thing was after I saw it I remembered when it had fallen down to the bottom but I had just filled it and got the salinity right and wasn’t about to waste all that to get it out, told myself I would get when I used up the water, well that never happened so up go the heavy metal. A 320 gallon tank and I needed months of water changes to get rid of the metals, just did the last one last weekend, but my lates icp test came back clean finally, must have gone thru over 2000 gallons of new water.
one small forgetful moment cost me dearly,and it was something so simple, I guess what I’m saying is don’t over think it, maybe it’s a simple fix.
one small forgetful moment cost me dearly,and it was something so simple, I guess what I’m saying is don’t over think it, maybe it’s a simple fix.
Skep18,
People on here know a lot more than me, but I tried the Photon V2's on my 200 Gal. and just could not get them to work. Went with an ATI 8 bulb T5 and things are looking great. Used VHO's in years past and they would grow anything. Think T5's are even better. This isn't saying LEDs won't grow fantasic tanks., they will. But to eliminate lighting as an issue. you could put a T5 fixture on it and later research and install a great LED system.
Good luck!
People on here know a lot more than me, but I tried the Photon V2's on my 200 Gal. and just could not get them to work. Went with an ATI 8 bulb T5 and things are looking great. Used VHO's in years past and they would grow anything. Think T5's are even better. This isn't saying LEDs won't grow fantasic tanks., they will. But to eliminate lighting as an issue. you could put a T5 fixture on it and later research and install a great LED system.
Good luck!
I was trying to get a higher resolution and deleted the video. Here’s the link again
I did have my mp40s on gyre at 20% on sync but I found it created some dead spots. I’m now using the reefcrest on anti sync at 50% and my acros seem to really love it. The PE isn’t quite as good at the higher flow but it’s still pretty good. Your recollection is correct that I thought reefcrest mode caused some rtn but I later realized that it was probably from a flucozanole treatment.
Crustaceon
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As far as flow goes, I think it’s less of a question of how much and more of a question of the quality of flow. I’ve ran 87x tank turnover that was mostly uni-directional aside from two ac pumps on a hydor wave controller alternating to break up the flow. I now run 50x turnover but its a very broad and turbulent flow throughout the tank. My corals are growing better in the lower flow. I feel the difference is in how the flow was reaching my corals. Before, I could only get certain corals to wiggle their polyps. Now, it’s every coral. IMO, getting rid of that boundary layer around our corals is what we should be chasing and not a number or setting.
As for nutrients, we used to think natural sea water levels were the best and I think a lot of people that managed to be successful had pastel reefs as result and at great difficulty. There was also this idea that phosphates above zero would inhibit calcification. Even in 2015 (like it was forever ago, lol) our equipment was perfectly capable of ridding our tanks of nitrates and phosphates and that was what people went for. A LOT of tanks crashed back then. Times have changed though and it’s simply far safer to not ride that edge of coral starvation so closely.
As for nutrients, we used to think natural sea water levels were the best and I think a lot of people that managed to be successful had pastel reefs as result and at great difficulty. There was also this idea that phosphates above zero would inhibit calcification. Even in 2015 (like it was forever ago, lol) our equipment was perfectly capable of ridding our tanks of nitrates and phosphates and that was what people went for. A LOT of tanks crashed back then. Times have changed though and it’s simply far safer to not ride that edge of coral starvation so closely.
MentalNote
Active Member
Dang Chaswood! Are you sure those are SPS and not turf algae? That polyp extension is amazing. I don't have that level of flow in my tank. Hmm... maybe time to crank up my MPs...
Thanks bud. I wish I could figure out a way to get a better resolution in the videos, but oh well. I’m finally seeing the Tenuis growth pattern I’ve been looking for since switching to the reefcrest mode and elevating my ph after discovering how low it was.
If I had to pick a top 3 guesses on the issue/solution.... (#3 is my pick though ... well... maybe #1...)
1) Although your no3/po4 doesn’t seem to be in “danger zone”, I’m sure you’ve read a lot on low no3/po4 issues already on r2r and people have mentioned it here. But this one in particular seems a bit similar (his po4 was much lower though at .002) with signs of success from raising no3/po4:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/fading-tissue.643267/
So maybe blitzing the po4 up at least... dosing or reef roids
2) If you don’t want to raise nitrates/phosphates, maybe drop alk closer to 7 (although... In your email you said it was 7 and raised to 8 just from salinity correction? So is it usually at 7 dkh? And issues were still present? If so, obviously this is moot. And even 8 is not too bad but eh... long shot)
3) Swinging back to flow... still on my mind that the rack getting hit with whatever makes it to them along the glass from 90% power of a 6000gph rated gyre push being too much... i know it doesn’t apply exactly but if you imagine that zone as a 50g tank (since it’s in that 1/4 area).. do people think their sps will be happy with a 6000 gph rated gyre blasting at 90% from the back corner in their 50g every 3 min for 3 min in one direction? On top of whatever the other 3 pumps contribute (Not rhetorical, really asking the people haha).
If not the strength of flow, maybe just getting hit from one direction mostly...but that’s also just referring to that frag batch since I don’t know where past unsuccessful frags have been placed.
1) Although your no3/po4 doesn’t seem to be in “danger zone”, I’m sure you’ve read a lot on low no3/po4 issues already on r2r and people have mentioned it here. But this one in particular seems a bit similar (his po4 was much lower though at .002) with signs of success from raising no3/po4:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/fading-tissue.643267/
So maybe blitzing the po4 up at least... dosing or reef roids
2) If you don’t want to raise nitrates/phosphates, maybe drop alk closer to 7 (although... In your email you said it was 7 and raised to 8 just from salinity correction? So is it usually at 7 dkh? And issues were still present? If so, obviously this is moot. And even 8 is not too bad but eh... long shot)
3) Swinging back to flow... still on my mind that the rack getting hit with whatever makes it to them along the glass from 90% power of a 6000gph rated gyre push being too much... i know it doesn’t apply exactly but if you imagine that zone as a 50g tank (since it’s in that 1/4 area).. do people think their sps will be happy with a 6000 gph rated gyre blasting at 90% from the back corner in their 50g every 3 min for 3 min in one direction? On top of whatever the other 3 pumps contribute (Not rhetorical, really asking the people haha).
If not the strength of flow, maybe just getting hit from one direction mostly...but that’s also just referring to that frag batch since I don’t know where past unsuccessful frags have been placed.
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ADAM
@AK_Reefs on Instagram
The brown slime in your pictures is the issue. That’s what is consuming the nutrients.....and your corals! You can see it in several of the photos and considering everything else is “OK”, it seems to be the only smoking gun.
Highlighted the brown slime in this pic and it is noticeable on the corals in many of the other pics you posted.
Sorry if you’ve arrived here already, I read to page 3. Your first few pictures planted the seed in my mind after your reading what you had written, the video clinched it.
To my mind, other than the apparent lack of stability which clearly needs remedy. The tank is insufficiently biologically mature. You appear to be showing Dinoflagellates and Bacterial films that should be long gone. These are the building blocks of life and the tank isn’t moving past them, in all likelihood this is to do with a lack of available nutrients and the balance of them there in.
Think of a garden, a rock grows lichens and the lichens die creating soil that weeds grow in, eventually over many years the weeds become soil and ultimately a forest grows. I hope that makes sense, it’s what we call the process of succession. Take that to your aquarium and your in the lichen stage.
Get it stable, water chemistry wise and push that biological processes by keeping nutrients detectable. Once you see the weeds grow, it will be near time to plant the trees.
To my mind, other than the apparent lack of stability which clearly needs remedy. The tank is insufficiently biologically mature. You appear to be showing Dinoflagellates and Bacterial films that should be long gone. These are the building blocks of life and the tank isn’t moving past them, in all likelihood this is to do with a lack of available nutrients and the balance of them there in.
Think of a garden, a rock grows lichens and the lichens die creating soil that weeds grow in, eventually over many years the weeds become soil and ultimately a forest grows. I hope that makes sense, it’s what we call the process of succession. Take that to your aquarium and your in the lichen stage.
Get it stable, water chemistry wise and push that biological processes by keeping nutrients detectable. Once you see the weeds grow, it will be near time to plant the trees.
I’m not sure those tanks showing sps added during yr 1 are absolutely the status quo and perhaps create a unrealistic expectation... I’d lump it all under maturity/stability just like previous posters are alluding to... dripping kalk does work and has anecdotal bennies. ... log your alk, pH and params ...look for trends ...good luck
I'm with the last two post concerning maturity/biodiversity. I look at your video and that looks like a sterile environment. I am not sure about others but there is no way I could keep my successful mixed reef looking that clean.
