230 gallon in-wall, room divider, reef build

Awesome! Thank you for giving me a very straightforward and concise answer. Hard to come by sometimes!


Haha thank you both @justingraham and @jsker! I am an engineer working on Mars rovers and i have a lot of CAD experience. Sadly, i am rather embarassed by this halfa**ed CAD i've displayed here but i'm glad you all like it! I find it really hard, and you have obviously seen it in this thread, to get technical concepts across 100% without clear diagrams.

That said, I still needed more so i printed some 1:1 and modified my design tonight. I think i'm ready to lock it in with the company! See images below!

Stress on the bulkheads were a major consideration in my designing. While yes, it isn't shown here, i worked over a few ideas and i think i am prepared for them to deliver the tank, standpipe-less and i will build the rest on my own.

I would have the same concerns as you regarding bulkhead cluster and glass, however, this tank is being built by A.G.E. and it is their style to go with 1" PVC bottom! Now, the strength is still a concern when considering torquing the bulkheads on 30" long pipes but i will be sure to secure the base of them well. I'm considering not just doing rock but also maybe taking a 12" tall, large diameter PVC pipe that will go around the PVC standpipe bottom section, then fill with mortar to stabilize the whole thing and keep them from stressing the bulkheads.

I understand your thinking here but you may not have to fill it, depending on the size pipe. My return column is hollow and without water inside of it :p It was a little bit of a trick but it worked. I used a 4" diameter pvc pipe and fit it to a pvc toilet bowl seating ring. (you can see it in the pic) It was siliconed all over the bottom so no seepage there and used a pipe cap at the top of the column with the perfect size hole cut into it for the pipe to go through and completely siliconed as well. This way if there is ever a problem I can cut the silicone away to get to the pipe and bulkhead.

@prsnlty I love what you did with your tank! Please tell me more about what DIY rock is? What exact products did you use? (please link me?) Your tank is stunning and i hope mine looks half as good as yours.
Thank you :D I love DIY Rock and here is the thread that started it for me. I believe my posts begin on page 5. https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/diy-rock-tutorial-info-thread-rocks-walls-floors-etc.31971/ and also on my build thread beginning somewhere around post 24 - 64 I think. I show how I did it and I think the recipe I use. If you should decide to try it feel free to ask questions :) If you are a hands on project kind of guy you'll love making the diy rock!

One deviation from your style it sounds like i want to make is to fill the bottom, at least half, of the rock-overflow-box with a solid of some sort such as mortar. The water doesn't need to fall all the way down there anyway (bean animal benifit) and so i don't want stagnant water down there so i'm going to reduce the depth of the box. Commented a light weight solution above ;)


I've decided to lock in my design as 1" pipes. 3 drain and one, likely to be, return. I say likely because if my 3x1" drains aren't enough drainage, i can adopt the 4th as a drain and route my return line up around the side of the tank through one of the structural columns i'm going to build to hold up the ceiling.
I actually have 2 - 1" drains and 3 returns on a 180g. You need to be sure to balance the return flow with the drain flow. I have a 3/4" in the column, a 3/4" over the back and a long sand bed spray bar that sits on top (semi buried) of the sand bed running down the center of the rock ridge and caves to keep fresh water flowing throughout.

Tonight, i decided my CAD wasn't enough and i printed 1:1 drawings of my tank's standpipes. I realized the 1.5" pipes are entirely too massive for my liking. I too agree @justingraham that 1" full siphon is around 600 to 900gph. From what i've been reading, i think this is roughly what i'm looking for. It should be adjustable to some degree with the open channel. And again, if all else fails and i need more flow/drainage, i can convert back in the 1" center "return" pipe as another 600-900gph drain and route my return up over the top.
Good idea and yes I agree with Justin too :)


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the 1.5" pipes were insane looking, too large and came too close to the walls for my comfort. Also, the stress concerns....:
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Thanks folks for getting engaged! I hope people are starting to get at least a little bit as excited as i am.

This weekend i'm hoping to get to demo'ing the wall and seeing whats underneath. Then CAD it up and start CAD building!

Stay tuned!
 
I have been asking the tank builder. Or rather, i have been interfacing with one of their sales reps who seems very knowledgable. He is a reefer himself, actually, he built their website and they kept him on as a side job for him as a sales rep. He works for Boeing and seems like a pretty knowledgeable guy.

A lot of these things i think are open to many options within the confines of physics.

I was thinking the same thing about surface skimming. I figured, worst case, i could find a way to perturb the surface but i think my overflow will work.

I may take advise of many of you and start with a tube of some sort. We will see when we get there and as i sleep on it!

A 6" round pvc pipe (should you go this route) will each give you approximately 15" each of surface skimming area. That's plenty if you have 2 but maybe not for 1. If you go the square box route in proportion to that picture it will be enough as well.

As far as the tube goes you can go to a real plumbing supply and ask what size pvc they carry. Home stores generally only carry up to 4". I got my 6" at the plumbing supply. Be forewarned though they will sell only what lengths they carry, 10'-20' and you have to take the whole pipe. But if you ask nicely they will cut it in half for you to get it home lol.
 
Ahh genius!!! Love the light weight idea. I have access to a quality 3D printer. I think I'll print a thick support pipe hole cluster insert to hold the shape of the cluster by the the bulk heads and then do you're idea for a light weight system. Love it!
 
Ahh genius!!! Love the light weight idea. I have access to a quality 3D printer. I think I'll print a thick support pipe hole cluster insert to hold the shape of the cluster by the the bulk heads and then do you're idea for a light weight system. Love it!
Great, I'm glad you like it and I hope it works out for you as well :D
 
I have 2 1" overflow standpipes with 6" pvc pipe as my overflow box column. This has a surface skimming area of 13" for each one = 26" of surface skimming total. This is more than enough surface skimming area. These columns are coated with diy rock and cured before install. I also have a free standing live diy rock column return. All this weight is away from the bulkheads. Here are some pics
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I alway like seeing the tank
 
Haha thank you both @justingraham and @jsker! I am an engineer working on Mars rovers and i have a lot of CAD experience. Sadly, i am rather embarassed by this halfa**ed CAD i've displayed here but i'm glad you all like it! I find it really hard, and you have obviously seen it in this thread, to get technical concepts across 100% without clear diagrams.

That said, I still needed more so i printed some 1:1 and modified my design tonight. I think i'm ready to lock it in with the company! See images below!

I have been CADing for a few years and I have no were the knowledge of the program that you do. That being said I am self taught and using the student version and not a cracked version. That is also really cool that you are working on the rovers, and they keep on going.
 
Thanks @Jimbo662

@prsnlty i just saw the pictures of the DIY rock and the toilet flanges. somehow missed it last night when i read your description. Even more genius than i originally thought. I love how the toilet flange and the weight kept to the exterior using the PVC surface coating (instead of filling like i wanted to do) keeps all the weight away from the bulkheads!

100% adopting this idea and running with it!
 
Haha, I spent no less than an hour at Lowe's staring at plumbing parts to come up with the idea [emoji12] Originally I made a different column completely covering the pipe . when it was completed and I picked it up I realized that that was too much weight on a bulkhead. I also thought about the constant pushing against it from powerheads. This made me think of cracking the glass at the bulkhead. So I tossed my original design for the return column. Then I came up with the hollow design once I found the correct parts. I'm glad that you can use this idea :D
 
Quickly tried my hand at "making rocks" yesterday after work! Curious to see how it turned out this afternoon. It did rain here last night (SoCal.....) but i anticipated that and covered my work under the carport. hopefully it is still okay and that 94lb back of portland didn't get wet in the storage shed!

I got the grey stuff as that is all my local place has.
@prsnlty, were you able to find Low pH, White? or did you just use white? I also liked that you did RO/DI. Makes a lot more sense to me chemically if you are trying to leach bad stuff out, diffusion gradient at max is desirable, also don't want to diffuse bad stuff in from tap water.

Also, i'm starting to plan out my sump. I am going to have a section for QT, electrical, and the sump itself. Curious what you all think on sizes. Is there an actual obligatory sizing on sump? My thoughts were always: anywhere from As big as you can fit/manage to as small as will still hold all your crap, bigger is better by virtue of more water volume of your entire system, but again, 230gals, i don't think +/- <10% is going to make that much of a difference in choosing a sump size (i.e 40gal vs 50gal) thoughts?

I think i am going to go with the Reef Octopus Elite 220. Good lord that thing is expensive. But then i remember how much i just cut a check for the tank and, well, relatively it's small and theres no point in any of this if you don't have good filtration.... one more step towards shrinking my allowable budget, one giant leap closer towards being single :) (kidding, gf is very supportive...though...she thinks i'm crazy....but thats nothing new i suppose....)


As for QT's, i have tons of room under my tank. I will be creating a partition between the sump and the QT area. don't want accidental cross contamination...ever.

I'm thinking either 2x5Gal tanks (1coral and 1fish, or 1x5Gal tank and 2x2.5Gal tanks (1coral and 2fish.....2 coral and 1 fish??? thoughts?) or i could do a bunch of 2.5gal. What do you all suggest? Working on CAD of options presently.

thanks folks! happy weekend!
 
since you live in socal, have you looked in to the advanced acrylics sumps? John does great work. You can either pick one out from the website or have him customize it any way you want.
 
No real such thing as low ph in cement because it is high alkalinity and that is the main reason we need to cure it until it comes down to 8.4 and stays there. Most will be a ph from 10 to 14 dkh. If you call your local cement company they may have a bag of white Portland or be able to tell you where you can get it. Be careful with the Portland because it needs to be stored in a cool dry place. It will turn hard on you if there's too much humidity or moisture. You can also get crushed argonite at feed stores it's sold as chicken feed LOL . but you can buy it there at a fraction of the cost. Just remember the larger the pieces you make the longer it takes to harden enough to pull out of the sand mold that you made. Also be sure that you wait about 36 hours to attempt to pull it . Unless they're small pieces that is.
 
BLUE: Full Siphon Standpipe
GREEN: Open Channel Standpipe
ORANGE: Emergency Standpipe
PINK: QT outlets can be hooked up to tubeing when it's time to drain them

Just finished a big pushup to design the QT section. 2x5gal tanks here. Lots of valves to allow me to pipe the full siphon flow into QT tanks for refill and i can drain QT tanks via the pink lines.

Also added electrical boxes on both sides on louver-style panels to allow access to underneath where there is valve

Let me know what you all think!

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I think it looks great as well

But first five gallon qt tanks are small real small
Second I think that with them being so close to the main tank there can and prob will be cross contamination between the two systems.
I would make it a frag tank or a big refugium
 
You can also get crushed argonite at feed stores it's sold as chicken feed LOL

I actually remember this! I built chicken coops at my house and my mothers house back in Maryland before I moved out her for JPL and we'd give aragonite to the hens for making their egg shells. Good thing theirs some feed places near by.

My rock turned out reasonably well for my first throw together try!! Probably mix up another one tomorrow that's more realistic of what I'd want to end up with for the tank. Then I'll hunt down white Portland.

I think it looks great as well But first five gallon qt tanks are small real small
Second I think that with them being so close to the main tank there can and prob will be cross contamination between the two systems.
I would make it a frag tank or a big refugium

How big do you think for a QT. I figure, a few weeks or a month or two in a small tank for a couple fish and corals at a time for preventative treatment and observation before releasing into the population five gallons is sufficient. They won't have to have mega water volume for stability because I can do regular water changes with main tank water easily with this setup. Also, I always have been weary about the large QTs. At some point, you're talking about having just another medium size population to risk infecting. I like the idea of lots of small QTs so you don't risk infecting already recovering organisms with something else/new. Am I completly off base?? Thanks!









So on to what I did today....

I started taking the wall down and my worst fear was just below the surface of that hideous wood paneling.
A gas line is literally in the middle of the wall.....crap!


So I need to figure out who to call to relocate this ASAP because this is one thing I'm not knowledgable enough to do with confidence. Blowing up and setting Angeles national forest on fire isn't on my agenda for this build.

Gotta find a plumber. Any LA area reefers plumbers out there??

Also, one down side to being an engineer with some home building experience.....I take the walls off and discover shudderingly awful, dangerous structural and electrical stuff!! Yikes! At least I get to fix it now....lots of work to do before the tank arrives in a few weeks!!

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Not off base but let's think out loud u have a 200 plus gallon tank I'm sure ur going to want tangs u think a tang is going to be okay in a five gallon tank? Let alone if you put another fish in there? How are u going to qt? 30 days of copper? If that is the case what if some of the qt water gets into the dt water no corals for you. With qting fish I would do them in installments do three fish the proper way copper prazi the works to make sure ur fish are good to go after u add them to the dt the go get another batch of fish. With qt ing corals and inverts u have to wait 72 days from first placing the coral in there u can add corals every day it will not restart the clock. But with corals u have to worry about pest as well like Afro eating flat worms and stuff so they don't get in the display. And the way u have it set up now with it being so close together there's a really good chance of cross contamination.

Ur starting a beautiful tank make sure no disease gets in from the beginning I had to restart my 90 and it was painful don't go thru what most of us have gone thru.

So if I were u I would do a ten gallon tank for frags and a 40 breeder for fish. I'm not a guru on qt but ask or look up humblefish and melphry on here and they can better assist donit right the first time ur planning so much with the tank right now don't skimp on qt please look up the thread qting 40-50 fish read thru it in fact look thru the past treads in the last hour as someone just commented on it to find it and see the pain and agony it caused him by not doing it right the first time so hopefully we won't make the same mistakes.
 

IF YOU HAD TO TAKE A REEFING EXAM, WOULD YOU PASS?

  • Yes!

    Votes: 32 45.7%
  • Not yet, but I have one that I want to buy in mind!

    Votes: 9 12.9%
  • No.

    Votes: 26 37.1%
  • Other (please explain).

    Votes: 3 4.3%
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