40 breeder with Tangs ethical?
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ParkerB
Active Member
Then what do you define it as? Cause its either successful or not. I mean IMO keeping it alive and healthy= successful lol. It dying is =unsuccessful.
Another sad thing is you don't feel a reef should be spotlighted cause it has tangs in a smaller then recommended tank. I mean none of that sps that's beautifully colored and growth means nothing all cause he has two purple tangs that are fine and healthy. Just kinda seems ignorant of you.
EDIT: two zebras not purple tangs
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Trex
Valuable Member
Now that you have gone with the "ignorant of you" route, there really isn't any point is trying to have further discussion with you.
dwilliams87
Valuable Member
I have a Tomini in a 20g and he is very happy! He not once has told me other wise. I keep him plenty to eat and over filtrate. My nitrates have never been above 5 and phosphates are always .03. Now can someone who opposes this tell me how they know a tang is happier in a 180g than in a 20g. All we can do is speculate! If he gets too large, I'll move him, if he quits swimming around, I'll move him. I spend a lot of time on my tanks and a lot of money. I say do what you want to do within reason.
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dwilliams87
Valuable Member
BTW, +1 Ritter.
It amazes me that we get ato worked up about the space fish have to swim and then lock a dog in a kennel where all he has is room to turn around. I love this hobby and I love my water inhabitants but the rediculous amount of arrogance in this thread is astounding. Has anyone ever went I to a LFS and told them how cruel it was to keep a tang in a 10 or 20 gallon tank? Why are we so concerned with tank space being a natural fit, but then we use chemicals or things that are unnatural to their habitat. The ocean doesn't use biopellots or GFO, I don't see anyone arguing over the cruelty of that. As hobbiest, we have to do the best we can. That's it.
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It amazes me that we get ato worked up about the space fish have to swim and then lock a dog in a kennel where all he has is room to turn around. I love this hobby and I love my water inhabitants but the rediculous amount of arrogance in this thread is astounding. Has anyone ever went I to a LFS and told them how cruel it was to keep a tang in a 10 or 20 gallon tank? Why are we so concerned with tank space being a natural fit, but then we use chemicals or things that are unnatural to their habitat. The ocean doesn't use biopellots or GFO, I don't see anyone arguing over the cruelty of that. As hobbiest, we have to do the best we can. That's it.
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chort55
unregistered
Comparing a 40 breeder to a 15x15 room.... no, a kid in a 15x15 room has some wiggle room. A mature tang in a 40b, not so much.
navila06
Well-Known Member
Trex
Valuable Member
How long are the fish at the LFS left in those 10 to 20 tanks? That isn't long term, just like there wouldn't be an issue using a 20 as a QT for a tang, but would be an issue as a DT.
chort55
unregistered
I don't agree with tangs at the LFS being in 10-20g tanks (or less) even..... and neither does my LFS (which uses 50g min for all fish), although most tangs go into the 200-300g tanks for this vary reason because there is always someone that says... "Oh its ok my LFS has them in tiny betta bowls so I can too".
Trex
Valuable Member
Didn't say that I agreed with it, was just pointing out that comparing an LFS' 20 to a home 20 is akin to comparing apples and oranges -- one is temporary and the other is long term.
dwilliams87
Valuable Member
I agree it is meant to be temporary, but I know ive watch a tang in a 20g for at least 6 months before.
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PaulKreider
Valuable Member
Dogs are kept in kennels smaller than they can turn around in to prevent them from defficating in there... Were not trying to stop the tang from pooping. This thread was about whats ethical not possible, go sit in an ethics class and youl realize this is unethical. Im fresh out of surgery and on painkillers so cant qwuite remember whaat about the class but its not ethical that's for sure.
There is so much about this post;
The people saying not to do it are being arrogant but the people saying to do it anyway even though professionals and hobbyist with experience in the matter say not to are being academic? My definition of arrogant is going against the advice of the norm because you feel your opinion carries more merit, the arrogance statement is hypocritical to say the least.
Second comparing a dog in a kennel to a five inch purple tang in a 3 foot tank is a terrible comparison, dogs in the wild seek out small body sized shelters to feel safe and for protection. During a thunderstorm, when in trouble, an random times in the day my dog will lay in his kennel because he feels safe there. This would not be the same if affording a purple tang the same opportunity. I know your respond will be neither will a six foot by two foot cube either, but this is still practically a three times the size foot print when comparing area.
Third when a hobbyist uses gfo or carbon, they are not adding the medium to the water. The medium is pulling out substances that would not be found in the animals natural environment is those quantities.
Fourth, tangs in LFS are not in permanent settings and are expected to be placed in a proper setting in a relatively short period of time.
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dwilliams87
Valuable Member
Regardless of anything said on here if we're talking about a 20 gallon verses a 90 gallon verses a 180 gallon against the ocean there is no comparison. If we really want to get into Ethics a lot of people that get deep into that would say we should never even take them out of the ocean. Why do we take them out of the ocean because we are a selfish people who want what we want. So how can a person who has a 180 gallon tank say to someone that has a 50 gallon tank I can do this but you can't do that. That's what I mean by arrogance.
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Dana
Well-Known Member
i feel that if you do your best to keep your fish happy and healthy, thats all that really matters. as for tangs in small tanks, buy a small tang at least. lets face it, everything we keep would probably be happier in the ocean….
ethical or not ethical… whatever…. ive had many fish die on me, not for lack of caring or trying.
ethical or not ethical… whatever…. ive had many fish die on me, not for lack of caring or trying.
navila06
Well-Known Member
my name is Nick and I have a 55 gallon tank with a blue tang, kole tang, 3 chromis, a six line wrasse, and a LMB living together. I can care less what any one thinks of that. It is my money and my fish. Blue tangs are considered a bait fish. So keeping one in my piece of the ocean is keeping him from possibly being cut up into pieces and used as bait. you're welcome little fishy.
Keepnitreel
Active Member
Kole tangs are cool. I use to have a kole tang & a lemon peel angel in a 55g, they would follow each other around picking on rocks all day.
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navila06
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