Acropora Help Please

[Daniel 123]

Leather corals, especially sarcophytons, do release a toxin into the water continuously, terpenoids. It's a major growth inhibitor that allows the leather to flourish and the other corals to wane. Running carbon in a tank with leathers is always a good idea as it soaks up many of those toxins, along with water changes.
Did a quick search to make sure I wasn't feeding you any bad info... to what extent do these toxins go, Im not sure, I had a problem in a 20 gal frag tank, in a matter of days adding a sarco, and other leathers, my sps were gone.

 

[Skep18]

Read and watching.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I see many impacting factors from garage location. First would be temperature. Foreign atmospheric ingredients such as gras, pollen, fumes and insecticides. Thermal changes, dust and even ph swings from air exchange.
Feeding seems a bit excessive and may be altering chemistry which has an adverse effect on mainly SPS and inverts. I would not focus on carbon unless warranted.
Is tank top open or covered? Being in a garage, I would have it covered with glass to eliminate chances of foreign matter being introduced into system

 

[topjimmy]

I have the exact same problem. Sps live for about a month with no visual growth, no pe, but stay colored up. Then one day the tips will start to receed, then the base, then I have a lovely white skeleton in about a week. It's so frustrating to see pictures of others tanks that grow coral like a weed only to watch them die in your tank. My parameters are just like yours. All in the zone. Stable. I never see any pests. I have no evidence, but I think it's bacterial.

I recently just rebooted the whole thing. I had a lot of brown palythoa that were growing all over and I was just tired of fighting them. I am two months out from the restart and am going to get the tank as stable as possible and then try again.

 

[gherewolf]

Quickly want to say that the ICP test is on its way to the lab. I’m hoping to rule out any foreign contaminants and move on to other theories but we shall see. Can’t wait to share the full results.

 

[gherewolf]

I never leave my magnet cleaners in the tank. Always take them out when you’re not using them.

You may not see anything, but they are leaching into the tank.

Two of the three I can easily remove daily after using. The third one...and call me lazy... is on the front glass and the tank has no access from the front. After I remove the magnet I either have to get someone to hold the magnet on the other side when I am ready to clean or tape the magnet to the outside of the tank, then walk to the garage to put the magnet back on the inside. Major problems....I know.

Anyways, I am hoping nothing shows abnormal in the ICP test but if the magnets were leaching anything that would show in the test, right? I'd love to eliminate that altogether.

Leather corals, especially sarcophytons, do release a toxin into the water continuously, terpenoids. It's a major growth inhibitor that allows the leather to flourish and the other corals to wane. Running carbon in a tank with leathers is always a good idea as it soaks up many of those toxins, along with water changes.
Did a quick search to make sure I wasn't feeding you any bad info... to what extent do these toxins go, Im not sure, I had a problem in a 20 gal frag tank, in a matter of days adding a sarco, and other leathers, my sps were gone.

That's terrible to hear, especially since I have a good size leather. Like I said before I do love leathers, but I think I love acropora more. The leather was one of the first corals in the tank so that would make sense if terpenoids or any other toxins have been released. As most leathers are, there are good days and bad days where they are all shrivled or open and beautiful. I can't seem to explain it.
I have been running carbon only on and off but nothing consistent. It sounds like while I have any type of leathers in the tank I should be running carbon. That is if I decide to keep the coral. Still waiting on PAR and ICP test results before moving on to that. Great information, thank you.

Read and watching.

Chime in if you sense something!

I see many impacting factors from garage location. First would be temperature. Foreign atmospheric ingredients such as gras, pollen, fumes and insecticides. Thermal changes, dust and even ph swings from air exchange.
Feeding seems a bit excessive and may be altering chemistry which has an adverse effect on mainly SPS and inverts. I would not focus on carbon unless warranted.
Is tank top open or covered? Being in a garage, I would have it covered with glass to eliminate chances of foreign matter being introduced into system

You are right, there are a lot of things that can go wrong in a garage. I have very good control over the temperature in the summer and winter with over sized heaters and chiller. I also have not seen any pH swings outside of the normal 7.8 to 8.2 daily swings. I don't store any chemicals except for Bayer insect killer for my dips. Dust could potentially be an issue though because I do see some buildup on the light fixtures but I don't think any more than what would be inside. The tanks are open on the top. The suspense of the ICP test is killing me!

I have the exact same problem. Sps live for about a month with no visual growth, no pe, but stay colored up. Then one day the tips will start to receed, then the base, then I have a lovely white skeleton in about a week. It's so frustrating to see pictures of others tanks that grow coral like a weed only to watch them die in your tank. My parameters are just like yours. All in the zone. Stable. I never see any pests. I have no evidence, but I think it's bacterial.

I recently just rebooted the whole thing. I had a lot of brown palythoa that were growing all over and I was just tired of fighting them. I am two months out from the restart and am going to get the tank as stable as possible and then try again.

I hear you on the frustration and hope the reboot makes a difference. How is it going so far and when do you plan on adding your first acroporas?

 

[Scdell]

I'm actually curious and interested to see what your ICP test shows. Then it will confirm it for me if it comes back with the same metals.

 

[gherewolf]

Also, I cleaned out my ATO reservoir today. I have been using a 20h tank sitting under the frag tank. I emptied, soaked in Vinegar/Water, and scrubbed really good. During the soak I saw some weird stuff in there that made the water a little murky. Glad that is clean now and I added a lid to the top as it wasn't covered before.

 

[Flippers4pups]

Also, I cleaned out my ATO reservoir today. I have been using a 20h tank sitting under the frag tank. I emptied, soaked in Vinegar/Water, and scrubbed really good. During the soak I saw some weird stuff in there that made the water a little murky. Glad that is clean now and I added a lid to the top as it wasn't covered before.

Most likely bacteria.

 

[Scdell]

Also, I cleaned out my ATO reservoir today. I have been using a 20h tank sitting under the frag tank. I emptied, soaked in Vinegar/Water, and scrubbed really good. During the soak I saw some weird stuff in there that made the water a little murky. Glad that is clean now and I added a lid to the top as it wasn't covered before.

Basically if you want to keep sps? Your husbandry needs to be a lot better.

 

[goodefx]

have you tried playing with your ALK levels? I know your not a noob so I'll spare the stability speech, but I had the same issues since I used to think ALK at 10 was key...then 9..then 8.5 and now I'm maintaining 8 and finally starting to see growth. No two tanks are the same but my parameters are very similiar to yours, so it might worth a shot to lower it and see what happens. This is advice I got when visiting WWC one day, and they run their tanks at 8.

I'm sure you might have "Canary" coral that could be monitored for positve changes.

 

[topjimmy]

I hear you on the frustration and hope the reboot makes a difference. How is it going so far and when do you plan on adding your first acroporas?

4 months. Then something easy to keep.

 

[gherewolf]

Most likely bacteria.

Definitely not good if I have been adding bacteria into the system though my top off water. I am going to add this to my routine maintenance list to clean this out every 3-6 months.

Basically if you want to keep sps? Your husbandry needs to be a lot better.

Absolutely agree. I need to shift my approach to being more proactive than reactive.

 

[gherewolf]

have you tried playing with your ALK levels? I know your not a noob so I'll spare the stability speech, but I had the same issues since I used to think ALK at 10 was key...then 9..then 8.5 and now I'm maintaining 8 and finally starting to see growth. No two tanks are the same but my parameters are very similiar to yours, so it might worth a shot to lower it and see what happens. This is advice I got when visiting WWC one day, and they run their tanks at 8.

I'm sure you might have "Canary" coral that could be monitored for positve changes.

You can still give the stability speech as it is always a good reminder

I tested all this am and it’s at 8.7. I could slowly bring it down a little and see what happens. I don’t want to change too many things at once though but will add this to my list of possible adjustments after I see the ICP and par results.

Another thing that I’ve been thinking about is my water changes and the salt I’m using. I’ve been doing 40 gallon water changes which is about 20% every month but the salt I’m using I believe has a higher alkalinity around 10 and may be causing a slight spike on every water change if I maintaining the system at 8.5. Something I probably need to think about either changing salts to one with lower alkalinity, or doing smaller water changes to avoid any swings.

 

[topjimmy]

I don't think that a 20% change is going to mess up alkalinity too much. You could always test the new water and adjust it.

 

[gherewolf]

I don't think that a 20% change is going to mess up alkalinity too much. You could always test the new water and adjust it.

Good call I am going to make a 20 gallon batch and then test the alk before changing.

In other news. I switched out all of my RO/DI unit filters. That includes the sediment, carbon blocks, and RO membrane (color changing DI resin still has some left from the last change). I also tested my top off water and tank water for chlorines and chlorimines. Glad to report nothing there.

 

[Daniel 123]

Tuned in for water parameter results, this is like a good book in here.

 

[goodefx]

You can still give the stability speech as it is always a good reminder

.

I went from red sea to reef salt crystals because of the same thing, cheaper too! Hope it helps!

 

[ShadowR55]

what fish do you have? I hade a flame angel for a few months before I started adding more and more coral. New coral would show polyp extension for a few days and then stop. Wellsophyllia would be nice and plump for a few days and then shrivel up. Nothing would die and everything was growing slowly but nothing looked happy other than my Zoa’s and shrooms. Then I read a post on here about the flame angel took it to my local LFS for a trade. A few days later everything came to life again, great polyp extension on my SPS and awesome inflation on my LPS.

I watched my tank like a hawk, as a matter of fact, I don’t think I ever saw the flame angel nip at my corals but it must have been doing it at night when polyps come out to feed.

Check for pests and watch your fish to make sure nothing is ticking off your coral to the point of RTN.

 

[gherewolf]

Tuned in for water parameter results, this is like a good book in here.

haha the suspense is killing me too! The ICP company said it could take 4 days so I am expecting something next week since it just shipped out a couple days ago.

I went from red sea to reef salt crystals because of the same thing, cheaper too! Hope it helps!

I like less expensive alright. I ended up soaking my salt water mixing barrel with a vinegar mixture, scrubbing, then rinsing this morning. Water is currently being made for the new batch of salt.

what fish do you have? I hade a flame angel for a few months before I started adding more and more coral. New coral would show polyp extension for a few days and then stop. Wellsophyllia would be nice and plump for a few days and then shrivel up. Nothing would die and everything was growing slowly but nothing looked happy other than my Zoa’s and shrooms. Then I read a post on here about the flame angel took it to my local LFS for a trade. A few days later everything came to life again, great polyp extension on my SPS and awesome inflation on my LPS.

I watched my tank like a hawk, as a matter of fact, I don’t think I ever saw the flame angel nip at my corals but it must have been doing it at night when polyps come out to feed.

Check for pests and watch your fish to make sure nothing is ******* off your coral to the point of RTN.

This is very revealing information. I knew I would be running a risk adding this fish which was probably foolish to begin with. It comes back to that same question with the leather. Do I like keeping acropora more than a flame angel? When I look at some of the pictures from users in this forum, the answer is always yes. Maybe time for me to get out the fish trap. I'm terrible at catching fish though. any suggestions?

My full fish list is on Page 1 if you want to check it out and please raise a flag if you see anything else that could be questionable.