AliE LED bar vs. T5

[oreo54]

That OG 14000k hurts my brain. Here’s newer.

Mostly minor but visible differences. The 150w has a slightly different spectrum than thecv250,400 if I remember correctly.

 

[MarcosTacos]

Just 470nm, or consider repeating 410/420/470. The G5/G6 went meh on the lower violet. The below is all channels at 100%.

My main goal would be to add par in order to grow acropora. Would the 410/420/470 option be better suited for that with the added boost in the lower 400 range or would the full 470 do just as good? Trying to wrap my head around the led spectrum thing.

 

[Royal_pudding]

Do not believe Populargrow bars have channels either.
I'd need the power supply stats but looks to be 9 in series then, depending on length x number in parallel.
18,27,36 all divisble by 9.
I have a pattern, much like the reef crest.
Only 4 "colors". A toned neutral white with the proverbial broad blue band.
450's filled in by the white.
Diode actual nm are dependent
on what bin they get.
You can up the nm of whites but suggest never going beyond 8000k
will no longer be near 12000k-ish

Keep in mind these are napkin estimates and still not sure about you goal as to using it for "pop" or just par and a more non-blue look.x

Absolutely incredible. What a community this is!
Thank you so much for all the help
I will be sure to share some pics on how it works out once I order and set up.

 

[oreo54]

6:12:6 w:rb:b Blade ratios.
75% white, 25% blue is your comfort level.
Now did you orig. mean all blues or just the rb channel was dimmed ( there are 3 channels right?)
I did both..hopefully it's fairly easy to understand.
4.5 white 4.5 " blue"
4.5w,3rb, 6b

That's about your " sweet spot" translated to " led diode equivalency"
You basically shut off 15 out of 24 LEDs
Or 10.5 LEDs assuming reg blue was at 100%
So really 50:50 mix.
Or alternate 1:2. white:"blues"
Point of choosing either a different bar or custom is to not waste a lot of what you paid for.

Keep in mind this sort of assumes each color is outputting the same # of photons.
So there is a bit of a fudge here.
It isn't always the case.
I'm guessing the blades blues and whites are fairly equivalent in output.

History..

Warm White, Neutral White, and Cool White? Help clear the haze!

Can someone please explain to me or point me in the right direction to better understanding which is better. I see a lot of people using cool white leds and yet read an article stating cool white led is useless in a reeftank. I also have read that the neutral whites 5k are the better leds to...

www.reef2reef.com

See post #7 for thoughts on the use of low k whites. Well the whole thing really..

If you get really bored .

LED Aesthetics: What do you really think of your color?

Hey there, I thought i would link to here in order to get more opinions and ideas regarding the overall color appearance of LED setups. There has been quite a large conversation going on over here,http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1885076 and i think this concerns nano owners as ...

www.nano-reef.com

The age of those discussions is sort of interesting.
Btw:
For your own safety (less chance of poor diodes) probably best to shift the whites to 5000k.
Sorry for the late correction. Was obsessing over the real 12000k ish thing.

For fun why I find things like the blade sort of humerous:

Posted September 16, 2010
470nm cool blue, with cool white and royal blue is an awesome combo, and has brought out good colors on my sps

Feels like going full circle.

 

[Royal_pudding]

6:12:6 w:rb:b Blade ratios.
75% white, 25% blue is your comfort level.
Now did you orig. mean all blues or just the rb channel was dimmed ( there are 3 channels right?)
I did both..hopefully it's fairly easy to understand.
4.5 white 4.5 " blue"
4.5w,3rb, 6b

That's about your " sweet spot" translated to " led diode equivalency"
You basically shut off 15 out of 24 LEDs
Or 10.5 LEDs assuming reg blue was at 100%
So really 50:50 mix.
Or alternate 1:2. white:"blues"
Point of choosing either a different bar or custom is to not waste a lot of what you paid for.

Keep in mind this sort of assumes each color is outputting the same # of photons.
So there is a bit of a fudge here.
It isn't always the case.
I'm guessing the blades blues and whites are fairly equivalent in output.

History..

Warm White, Neutral White, and Cool White? Help clear the haze!

Can someone please explain to me or point me in the right direction to better understanding which is better. I see a lot of people using cool white leds and yet read an article stating cool white led is useless in a reeftank. I also have read that the neutral whites 5k are the better leds to...

www.reef2reef.com

See post #7 for thoughts on the use of low k whites. Well the whole thing really..

If you get really bored .

LED Aesthetics: What do you really think of your color?

Hey there, I thought i would link to here in order to get more opinions and ideas regarding the overall color appearance of LED setups. There has been quite a large conversation going on over here,http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1885076 and i think this concerns nano owners as ...

www.nano-reef.com

The age of those discussions is sort of interesting.
Btw:
For your own safety (less chance of poor diodes) probably best to shift the whites to 5000k.
Sorry for the late correction. Was obsessing over the real 12000k ish thing.

For fun why I find things like the blade sort of humerous:

Feels like going full circle.

Haha no I see where you are going with this, no need for sorries!
It is a real good point I'm only using a part of the Blade, im going to use some of the blue in conjunction with royal blue and cool white. Blue has been completely off thus far.

Would you then recommend dropping the blue diodes from 12k draft from before, in favor of something else?

I will read up on these posts until the boss gets here. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction

 

[MarcosTacos]

My main goal would be to add par in order to grow acropora. Would the 410/420/470 option be better suited for that with the added boost in the lower 400 range or would the full 470 do just as good? Trying to wrap my head around the led spectrum thing.

Any one has input on this? I would like to order 2 bars to supplement my xr15 g5 pro and can't decide on full 470 or 470/420/410

 

[oreo54]

Any one has input on this? I would like to order 2 bars to supplement my xr15 g5 pro and can't decide on full 470 or 470/420/410

One could argue that the 410/420 is less efficient in photosynthesis based on the absorption characteristics of chl A.

Chlorophyll a' is present in the chloroplasts. It is a chief pigment that exhibits a higher rate of photosynthesis. 'Chlorophyll a' shows maximum absorption at wavelengths 430-470 nm (blue region) and 660-670 nm (red region).

That said, leds at 450nm may be err.."best".
Depending on whos data you look at 470 is fine.
Action spectra shows more 470 useage than the isolated chl A absorption spectrum probably due to the contribution of absorption by Perdinin.

Bottom line:
If PAR is all that matters the 470 is arguably better than 410/20/70 but may be splitting hairs a bit.

 

[telegraham]

Any one has input on this? I would like to order 2 bars to supplement my xr15 g5 pro and can't decide on full 470 or 470/420/410

Here's your light running AB+ overlayed with Chl a (pink) and Chl b (yellow). You have 450nm covered (Chl b), and suggest not adding more. But then there's Chl a, and you're not hitting those peaks much at all. As you mentioned, a 410/420/470nm bar would compliment the G5 Radion quite well. The lower spectrum diodes would hit Chl a. The 470nm will give you some pop the Radion is lacking.

If it helps, here's a 425/440/470nm DIY version of the AliE bar that I ran with my G4 XR30. Those three were repeated along the length of the 24" bar. Totally stuck that thing in the oven and did some hot swapping. Yes...it's that easy.

Science stuff aside, you'll dig the added fluorescence of the 410/420nm. The G4 had that deep blue (415nm) that many users liked. And you know that biology band BRS mentions? That's PUR, and you'd be improving that quite a bit.

-Jim

 

[MarcosTacos]

Glad I ordered the 410/420/470 version then. I'll report back once I get them, they are from EPOCHSHINE Aquaponic Store, I was quoted 100USD for 2 55cm bars with that spectrum, and they include a timer with dimmable function and 90 degree lenses.

Correct me if i'm wrong but the 90 degree lenses look more appealing for me since the bars cover the entire width of my tank (23 ish inches) and will focus the light more towards the part of the tank I keep sps in, instead of spreading it towards the edges where I keep some of my lps. My tank is about 20 inches deep.

 

[Hooz]

Glad I ordered the 410/420/470 version then. I'll report back once I get them, they are from EPOCHSHINE Aquaponic Store, I was quoted 100USD for 2 55cm bars with that spectrum, and they include a timer with dimmable function and 90 degree lenses.

Correct me if i'm wrong but the 90 degree lenses look more appealing for me since the bars cover the entire width of my tank (23 ish inches) and will focus the light more towards the part of the tank I keep sps in, instead of spreading it towards the edges where I keep some of my lps. My tank is about 20 inches deep.

The lens/beam width has a lot to do with how high you mount the lights. Due to spread (beam width), the optimal height above the water for a Radion is 8-ish inches. They just released a lens "upgrade" to narrow the beam for deeper tanks and/or higher mounting, but their stock lens is good at 8" above the water.

Lights like the AI Prime/Hydras have narrower stock beams, so they need to be mounted higher to cover the same surface area. That's why you see them mounted 10-14" above tanks (depending on the area you need to cover).

If you think of it this way... a 90 degree beam will have to be mounted half of the width of the area you want to cover. If you're trying to light a 24" wide area, you'll need the light mounted 12" high. A 100 degree lens drops that to 10", and a 120 degree lens would drop that to 7". Make sense?

The hard part is if you mix beam angles. If your primary lighting is a Radion mounted at 8", and your supplemental lighting uses 90 degree lenses, you might get some noticeable color separation (disco ball) if you mount the bars at 8". Conversely, if you raise the Radions to a 12" height to match the supplemental bars' optimum height, you'll spill a TON of light into the room. Wasted PAR. But in that instance, the "upgrade" lens from Ecotech should solve the issue.

 

[Hooz]

Any one has input on this? I would like to order 2 bars to supplement my xr15 g5 pro and can't decide on full 470 or 470/420/410

@telegraham is absolutely correct. Technically, you could grow coral using nothing but 450nm blue LEDs. They may not look the greatest, but they would certainly grow.

I agree 100% with the BRS "biology band" premise, I only disagree with the arbitrary lower and upper limits they chose. Personally, I want to hit as much as I can between 395nm and 500nm. The colors you chose should compliment your Radion perfectly to fill in what's missing.

 

[oreo54]

My apologies for picking a chl a reference that is a bit questionable.
A bit better as to the actual absorption. Note the "spread" around the peaks (FWHM):

https://opg.optica.org/oe/fulltext.cfm?uri=oe-31-13-22233&id=531802

That said keep in mind the difference between a pigment or absorption without production and an overall action spectra that includes all the pigments and actual "work" done such as o2 production.

 

[oreo54]

@telegraham is absolutely correct. Technically, you could grow coral using nothing but 450nm blue LEDs. They may not look the greatest, but they would certainly grow.

I agree 100% with the BRS "biology band" premise, I only disagree with the arbitrary lower and upper limits they chose. Personally, I want to hit as much as I can between 395nm and 500nm. The colors you chose should compliment your Radion perfectly to fill in what's missing.

BRS may have gave it a catchy name but the concept is old..

Coral Color Management｜BlueHarbor

This is a coral color management theory created by scientifically understanding the color of coral from an optical perspective.

www.blueharbor.co.jp

두발로 걷는 길 - 2019년 새해 福 많이 받으세요 : 네이버 블로그

blog.naver.com

 

[Hooz]

BRS may have gave it a catchy name but the concept is old..

Coral Color Management｜BlueHarbor

This is a coral color management theory created by scientifically understanding the color of coral from an optical perspective.

www.blueharbor.co.jp

두발로 걷는 길 - 2019년 새해 福 많이 받으세요 : 네이버 블로그

blog.naver.com

I've been hitting it hard on my LuxEngine LEDs for more than 3 years now, we just didn't have the catchy name until 6 months ago!

 

[MarcosTacos]

The lens/beam width has a lot to do with how high you mount the lights. Due to spread (beam width), the optimal height above the water for a Radion is 8-ish inches. They just released a lens "upgrade" to narrow the beam for deeper tanks and/or higher mounting, but their stock lens is good at 8" above the water.

Lights like the AI Prime/Hydras have narrower stock beams, so they need to be mounted higher to cover the same surface area. That's why you see them mounted 10-14" above tanks (depending on the area you need to cover).

If you think of it this way... a 90 degree beam will have to be mounted half of the width of the area you want to cover. If you're trying to light a 24" wide area, you'll need the light mounted 12" high. A 100 degree lens drops that to 10", and a 120 degree lens would drop that to 7". Make sense?

The hard part is if you mix beam angles. If your primary lighting is a Radion mounted at 8", and your supplemental lighting uses 90 degree lenses, you might get some noticeable color separation (disco ball) if you mount the bars at 8". Conversely, if you raise the Radions to a 12" height to match the supplemental bars' optimum height, you'll spill a TON of light into the room. Wasted PAR. But in that instance, the "upgrade" lens from Ecotech should solve the issue.

Right... i'm talking to the seller right now, maybe I should ask what lenses he has available to change them out for my current mounting height (I think its 8 or 9 inches since I use the AMS mount, I was thinking of doing something similar to this:

Cooked up a DIY mounting solution for the AliE bars with XR15.

 

[bryznsreef]

Hey just saw this thread, picked a bar up a few weeks ago. Does anyone know how much par the bars give off? I have the 4 foot bar and dont have access to a par meter to do readings I just dimmed my g5 xr30's down and observing my corals

 

[MarcosTacos]

I don't have one so can't measure but there are a couple reports. Watch innapropriate reefer's videos on the AliE bars, he measures par on his tank with and without the light.

 

[bryznsreef]

I don't have one so can't measure but there are a couple reports. Watch innapropriate reefer's videos on the AliE bars, he measures par on his tank with and without the light.

Thanks ill go rewatch that sometime today

 

[Acros]

Hey just saw this thread, picked a bar up a few weeks ago. Does anyone know how much par the bars give off? I have the 4 foot bar and dont have access to a par meter to do readings I just dimmed my g5 xr30's down and observing my corals

I got about 100-120 par through out the tank with the below setup. Tank dimensions 24" x 16".

AliE LED bar vs. T5

This thread led me (no pun) to discover luca, quanta bars, and telegraham on youtube. Thanks for the 2 day deep dive of led bar knowledge. I did email luca wondering if the quantum bars could be dimmable and his reply was golden.. such a perfect bar imo just hate that you can't dim them. I...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[telegraham]

The hard part is if you mix beam angles. If your primary lighting is a Radion mounted at 8", and your supplemental lighting uses 90 degree lenses, you might get some noticeable color separation (disco ball) if you mount the bars at 8". Conversely, if you raise the Radions to a 12" height to match the supplemental bars' optimum height, you'll spill a TON of light into the room. Wasted PAR. But in that instance, the "upgrade" lens from Ecotech should solve the issue.

This is a great point, and if you can mount lights ~12" (my sweet spot because I don't want to worry about low lights over a tank), that 70°ish lens swap might be the right move.

I agree 100% with the BRS "biology band" premise, I only disagree with the arbitrary lower and upper limits they chose. Personally, I want to hit as much as I can between 395nm and 500nm.

This, too! I run a spectrum hits 385nm (UV peak, not ramp) to 500nm.