Brooklynella or Marine Velvet?

[johnbr]

You look to be in decent shape to me ... the filter isn't gigantic, but two small ocellaris clowns don't make for a gigantic bioload, so I think you're good there.

I would add an ammonia alert badge similar to the pH one you've got. Liquid ammonia tests won't work properly in the presence of copper, but the badge should.

~Bruce

Hi Bruce,

Regarding the ammonia badge, I have a seneye reef monitor which gives me real time changes in the ammonia and also send me notifications directly into my phone. I'll be using that to monitor O2, ph and ammonia.

Right now I'm running copper at 0.10. O tuesday will be 48 hours and by the bottle it says that I would have to re-dose it. Should I do a water test before doing it?

thanks

 

[Maritimer]

Ah ... Seneye. I think you mentioned that. Silly me.

When I'm raising copper, I'll add some (small doses, given the size of my QT) in the morning, and some in the evening, until my test kit shows that I've reached therapeutic levels. I keep the dosing instructions on the label in mind as a convenient sort of a guide ... but I listen to the test results.

~Bruce

 

[johnbr]

Ah ... Seneye. I think you mentioned that. Silly me.

When I'm raising copper, I'll add some (small doses, given the size of my QT) in the morning, and some in the evening, until my test kit shows that I've reached therapeutic levels. I keep the dosing instructions on the label in mind as a convenient sort of a guide ... but I listen to the test results.

~Bruce

Morning Bruce,

@Update

So today I already fed them and they ate really, really fast. I putted them under the white light and honestly I can't see anything on them. The only thing that bothers me is the cracks on their stripes. Could that be just dead skin? Could I be wrong since the beginning? The clown that was breathing rapidly now seems to be normal. Here are some pics from today

Ans one last fact. Both clowns were bought from world wide corals which is a known store all over the country. They leave their fishes under copper for at least 2 weeks so I don't think it came from them. Anyways just thinking loud here.

 

[Daltrey]

I would like to commend you for taking the time and effort to care for these fish.

Here is a pic of my quarantine.

 

[pluikens]

You look to be in decent shape to me ... the filter isn't gigantic, but two small ocellaris clowns don't make for a gigantic bioload, so I think you're good there.

I would add an ammonia alert badge similar to the pH one you've got. Liquid ammonia tests won't work properly in the presence of copper, but the badge should.

~Bruce

Also, isn't that pH badge only for freshwater?

 

[johnbr]

I would like to commend you for taking the time and effort to care for these fish.

Here is a pic of my quarantine.

Thank a lot @Daltrey

Nice setup by the way. Even though I'm new in the hobby I'm taking this really serious. Most people they rather leave the fish to die and buy another one. I don't think like first because it wasn't even fish that wanted to be on my tank to start. So I think is 100% my responsibility to try everything to keep them alive and happy.

Also, isn't that pH badge only for freshwater?

Hey @pluikens ,

that's right it is and is useless I just left there because I had one laying around.

LOL

 

[johnbr]

@Update

So today I already fed them and they ate really, really fast. I putted them under the white light and honestly I can't see anything on them. The only thing that bothers me is the cracks on their stripes. Could that be just dead skin? Could I be wrong since the beginning? The clown that was breathing rapidly now seems to be normal. Here are some pics from today

Ans one last fact. Both clowns were bought from world wide corals which is a known store all over the country. They leave their fishes under copper for at least 2 weeks so I don't think it came from them. Anyways just thinking loud here.

 

[S-t-r-e-t-c-h]

@Update

So today I already fed them and they ate really, really fast. I putted them under the white light and honestly I can't see anything on them. The only thing that bothers me is the cracks on their stripes. Could that be just dead skin? Could I be wrong since the beginning? The clown that was breathing rapidly now seems to be normal. Here are some pics from today

Ans one last fact. Both clowns were bought from world wide corals which is a known store all over the country. They leave their fishes under copper for at least 2 weeks so I don't think it came from them. Anyways just thinking loud here.

The marks are probably scars at the attachment sites. They should heal over time.

Fish don't just go listless or exhibit rapid breathing for no reason, so I'd trust your gut here and continue the full treatment cycle you have planned.

Regarding where the parasites came from... even the best stores can have ich. It's a fact of the hobby and stores just transfer too many organisms to maintain sterile conditions. Sure, good practices can reduce the frequency, it's just impossible to stay 100% pathogen free when you are constantly adding and removing highly stressed organisms. Remember though that the parasites could have come in from a fish or coral or invert or rock or really anything wet that came from another tank. Good luck with the quarantine.

 

[johnbr]

The marks are probably scars at the attachment sites. They should heal over time.

Fish don't just go listless or exhibit rapid breathing for no reason, so I'd trust your gut here and continue the full treatment cycle you have planned.

Regarding where the parasites came from... even the best stores can have ich. It's a fact of the hobby and stores just transfer too many organisms to maintain sterile conditions. Sure, good practices can reduce the frequency, it's just impossible to stay 100% pathogen free when you are constantly adding and removing highly stressed organisms. Remember though that the parasites could have come in from a fish or coral or invert or rock or really anything wet that came from another tank. Good luck with the quarantine.

Thanks a lot @S-t-r-e-t-c-h

How long should I QT them?

 

[S-t-r-e-t-c-h]

Thanks a lot @S-t-r-e-t-c-h

How long should I QT them?

Display tank needs to stay fallow for 76 days, so anticipate the fish being quarantine for at least that amount of time. Copper should get rid of velvet at around 2 weeks, so you don't need to medicate for that entire time...

 

[johnbr]

Display tank needs to stay fallow for 76 days, so anticipate the fish being quarantine for at least that amount of time. Copper should get rid of velvet at around 2 weeks, so you don't need to medicate for that entire time...

Amazing so I assume that after treating them I can start to control the ammonia using bio filtration since the copper would be gone and it will help to decrease the amount of water changes.

thanks

 

[Maritimer]

Copper isn't wiping out your bacterial filtration, though it probably is slowing it down a bit.

~Bruce

 

[johnbr]

Copper isn't wiping out your bacterial filtration, though it probably is slowing it down a bit.

~Bruce

Hey @Maritimer

My LFS told me to not even try to apply microbacter7 or something like that since copper kills everything

 

[Maritimer]

I keep an Aqua-Clear 110 with two sponges on my QT, and haven't had ammonia problems unless I add a bunch of fish. <shrugs> I've had a different experience from what your LFS suggests.

~Bruce

 

[johnbr]

@Maritimer

Can you point me the website where I can get both for my 10G QT

thanks

 

[Maritimer]

Both . . . ?

I was able to locate Bio-Spira and Dr. Tim's at Bulk Reef Supply:

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/instant-ocean-bio-spira.html

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/one-only-saltwater-live-nitrifying-bacteria-dr-tims.html

Didn't find the Aqua-Clear filters there, but they're at Dr. Foster/Smith:

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+3579+3610&pcatid=3610

Are those the things you're looking for?

~Bruce

 

[Gmj4409]

Hey @Maritimer

My LFS told me to not even try to apply microbacter7 or something like that since copper kills everything

Just to agree with Maritimer - you have to have some sort of kick start for any QT longer than a day a two or you’ll need to do water changes every 2nd or 3rd day. The microbacteria in a bottle may struggle a bit to take hold but they work. I also run a small sponge filter with air stone but any media helps. I sometimes need to do a second dose but they absolutely work in copper. Good luck!

 

[johnbr]

@update

Hi guys,

So this morning I woke up went to check the tank and one of the clowns was really bad. Rushed to do a fresh water dip but nothing. After 15 minutes back in the tank he was dead. I so upset now for real. I was dosing the copper, controlling EVERY freaking thing and this happens. I don't even know if the guys on my LFS were right the copper kills everything.

Here some pics:

 

[Sonam]

We went through this a few weeks ago. It was a nightmare. If we hadn't invested in a tank upgrade a few months ago (expensive) we probably would have left the hobby.
I can't say for sure but I do know that by the time any of the fish showed any white spots at all they all ended up dead. The parasites start inside the body of the fish I think so by the time we see symptoms they are deeply infected. If it was marine velvet as it was for us it happens super fast.
We did finally tear down the rocks in the display to place our remaining fish in quarantine while we wait out the life cycle of the parasites.
It is horrible. So sorry for your loss. We lost fish we have had for 5 years, since starting out. It was devastating.
The good news is so far our 3 remaining fish are healthy. The yellow tang had begun lurking in caves and not eating but the copper did help. It's still hard to believe we only have three fish left.

 

[johnbr]

We went through this a few weeks ago. It was a nightmare. If we hadn't invested in a tank upgrade a few months ago (expensive) we probably would have left the hobby.
I can't say for sure but I do know that by the time any of the fish showed any white spots at all they all ended up dead. The parasites start inside the body of the fish I think so by the time we see symptoms they are deeply infected. If it was marine velvet as it was for us it happens super fast.
We did finally tear down the rocks in the display to place our remaining fish in quarantine while we wait out the life cycle of the parasites.
It is horrible. So sorry for your loss. We lost fish we have had for 5 years, since starting out. It was devastating.
The good news is so far our 3 remaining fish are healthy. The yellow tang had begun lurking in caves and not eating but the copper did help. It's still hard to believe we only have three fish left.

Thanks for the support @Sonam

I felt the same way. Wanted to leave the hobby and just sell everything. Anyways I just want to know what my fish had cuz clearly wasn't ich. I have another clown that is clean and I'm planning to save. So if this is something that copper can't kill I need to know what to do right away and I ask you guys with more experience than I please, give a light.

Thanks a lot to all of you.