Gas Bubble Disease in Maroon Clown?

SandJ · Dec 10, 2015

Bought an established BioCube 29 on November 29th.
Contained 5" maroon clown, 2 small chromis, 2 yellow damsels, couple emits, snails and a peppermint shrimp
Beginning of november the seller had posted about the clown having the bubble on its side, so I know it has been there since then.
The maroon clown had a large "bubble/blister" on its side when I picked it up. Also a lump under the skin in the same spot. Next day it deflated, but lump under skin remains the same.
Clown acts normal, though not quite as aggressive as I would expect for a maroon. Eats like a pig, swims normal, no flashing, normal breathing.
The salinity of tank water was 1.022 when I brought it home 11/29, I have been topping off with salt water to slowly bring that up, salinity after water change last night was 1.024.
I did a 2 gallon water change last night 12/9, plus added more water to the back chamber to bring the volume up to the max level in chamber 3. So added a total of almost 3 gallons.
This morning there are 2 more bubbles in front of the previous bubble.

*I plan on rehoming most of these fish. Wanted to figure out what she has first.
Could this be gas bubble disease?

This is 11/30 after the large bubble deflated...

SandJ · Dec 10, 2015

These are the new bubbles on the white stripe today 12/10

ZoaCollector · Dec 10, 2015

It's definitely infected, wether or not you want to treat it is up to you. I would use something like kanaplex in a qt tank. Never in the main display.

melypr1985 · Dec 10, 2015

I agree that it's infected and antibiotics are needed, but what caused it is a mystery to me. My first thought is internal parasites/ worms or something of that nature. I'd like to know what @Humblefish says though

Humblefish · Dec 10, 2015

Could be an internal infection that has never completely healed. I agree Kanaplex would be the best antibiotic to use for this particular situation. Is this fish in a tank with corals/inverts or fish only?

SandJ · Dec 10, 2015

The new bubbles are clear and on the outside of the scales. I can see the scales through them and the scales are not affected.

There was a RBTA in the tank that was hosting the clown. Now there is a small frag of zoas, small frag of favia, and a small 1" BTA.

Forgot the inverts of peppermint shrimp, 2 hermits and snails.

Humblefish · Dec 10, 2015

So you're saying the bubbles are protruding outward? On the exterior of the fish's skin?

I looked at the pics again, and some of them look like a cut that has gotten infected while there's one from 11/30 that looks a little like Brooklynella to me.

Do you have a QT? I think at this point your best bet would be to QT the fish and treat with this concoction of meds: Furan-2, Seachem Kanaplex, Seachem Metroplex. The first two will treat if it's a bacterial infection, the latter treats brook. You'd be covered all ways.

SandJ · Dec 10, 2015

Yes, they are actual bubbles on the outside of the fish. The one that looks like brook is the deflated bubble. I am fairly certain it is not brook or velvet. No other fish has been affected and the rest of the clown's body looks perfect.

It looks just like blowing a bubble with chewing gum. It is a round, inflated, transparent bubble sticking out of the fish. Then it deflates and still has the loose skin(?).

The bubbles do not show up in the first picture from 12/10 because they are transparent and look flat in the photo, but If you look at the last picture from 12/10 you can see the new bubbles sticking out (between the white stripe on the body and red of the tail).

The previous bubble from 11/30 is now a smooth area on the clown. I can tell if the scales are missing or if there is something covering them.

Humblefish · Dec 10, 2015

You're kind of in uncharted waters here. I personally would treat for a bacterial infection and hope for the best. You could send the pics to Fenner and see what he thinks. This is not something I've ever seen/dealt with before.

SandJ · Dec 10, 2015

Thanks for the help! I have been researching this a lot and have came up empty handed. Closest thing I could find is the gas bubble disease.

Do I need better pictures?
How can I contact Fenner?

melypr1985 · Dec 10, 2015

Whatever you end up doing or finding out, will you please document everything and post it here? We would all love a chance to learn a little more about what this is and what does or doesn't work to treat it. Even if he dies, its still a chance to learn something new. Good luck!

SandJ · Dec 10, 2015

Mel, I would be happy to post any findings/info. I am very curious as to what the lump inside its body is, and if it is related to the bubbles. In the unfortunate event it dies, I will take the chance to find out.

Humblefish · Dec 10, 2015

SandJ said:
How can I contact Fenner?

[email protected]

Here is his bio: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/wwmadminsubwebindex/bobfbio.htm

I like him because he wrote one of my all time fav books, "The Conscientious Marine Aquarist".

SandJ · Dec 10, 2015

I figured out who you were talking about after I sent the message. I agree, great book and also part of my aquatic library.

Sent an email earlier and had a reply within a few hours :0)

I am going to go ahead and copy the email to here, if that is not allowed please let me know and I will delete it or have it deleted....

*********************

Hello, I am looking for some help with a Maroon Clown that came with an established BioCube 29 tank I brought home on 11/29/2015. Previous owner had this clown for at least 2 months and the “bubble” has been there since at least 11/2/2015.
<I see this in your excellent pix>
The day I brought the clown home, there was a bubble on its side. It was about 1/2” in diameter, protruding from the clowns side. There is also a lump under the clown’s skin.
The next day the bubble had deflated. A dark red or black line was visible on the deflated part, resembling a vein. Over the course of several days the bubble went away and the area became smoother. No scales are visible in that area.
On 12/9/15 I changed 2 gallons of water, plus added some to increase the level in the 3rd chamber (almost 3 gallons total). Salinity was 1.022 when I brought the tank home and I have been slowly increasing it (topping off with salt water). Salinity was 1.024 after the water change.
The next morning, 12/10, there was a new bubble in front of where the previous one was. This bubble is 1/8” in diameter, protrude from the scales, transparent and looks as if it is attached to the outside of the body.
Clown appears completely normal, eats, swims normally, no other marks on its body.
It shares a tank with 2 chromis, 2 yellow damsels, 2 hermits, a peppermint shrimp and snails (plan on rehoming the fish once I get this figured out).
<I take it the other Damsels (Clowns are part of the same family) don't overly harass the Premnas>
I am attaching a few photos, and happy to send more (or full size) if needed.
Thank you very much for your help!
<Well, the original cause/source of the bubble could be... a sharp poke, sting.... trauma... or bacterial, or as you state, maybe gas embolism. At this juncture; I would not do any "treatment" per se for this "owee", but render the usual good care, water quality and nutrition. It should heal over pretty much... in time. Bob Fenner>

Humblefish · Dec 10, 2015

I guess I have my doubts about this going away on it's own because the "bubbles" have inflated, deflated and now have inflated again, correct? Or are new bubbles forming after the old ones deflate?

Luka · Dec 10, 2015

Doing some research but can't find much try this site http://www.nationalfishpharm.com/fish_diseases/skin_disorders.html see if any of these pertain to the fish. Maybe abnominal dropsy looking at the front picture.

SandJ · Dec 10, 2015

Thanks for the link! I will work through the flow chart and look up some of these conditions.

Dropsy is something I had considered. I think I dismissed it because in most cases the belly was swollen on both sides, not just one. But most info I found was pertaining to freshwater fish, not marine.

The lump under the skin has to be something though.

Luka · Dec 11, 2015

So I have been doing quite a bit of research and I think it might be an ulcer. Ulcers are basically a wound that penetrates through the skin to the muscle. Ulcers on fish usually fail to heal on their own and the area around the ulcer will become inflamed. Later these inflamed areas will most likely get infected as well...just like the extension to the white stripes on 12/10. There are different kinds of treatments antibiotics is one of them. I may be wrong but after researching I found it to be most common. Here is another link you might want to check out http://www.saltwater-aquarium-online-guide.com/fish-diseases-and-treatments.html

Humblefish · Dec 12, 2015

Sounds similar to a peptic ulcer that humans get: https://umm.edu/health/medical/reports/articles/peptic-ulcers

Maybe try soaking metronidazole or tetracycline in fish food? There are more effective treatments, but both of those should be readily available.

SandJ · Mar 1, 2016

Thought I would update. The Maroon clown died on 1/22/2016.

That morning the clown was not able to control it buoyancy. The bubbles were gone and there was a hole where the bubbles had been. It acted normal up until this point. I turned the power heads off and it rested on the bottom. It died later that afternoon.

We went through a cycle of transparent bubbles...bubble goes down but there is still a transparent layer (looked like a deflated balloon)...bubble comes back a few days to a few weeks later and it is bigger and/or there are more......

After the fish died I set up a mini lab and collected as much info as I could. I am attaching a photo bucket album of all my photos.

1) Did a fresh water dip.
Nothing came off the fish.
2) Made a petri dish using homemade augar. Took a skin (scale?) scraping at the affected area.
Nothing grew on the plate except mold after a week or so.
3) Took a sample of the gills and looked at under the microscope.
Pictures attached, but nothing stood out to me.
4) Took a skin scraping and stained it with grams stain and looked at it under microscope.
Pictures attached, did not know exactly what to look for
5) Dissected the fish. See photos.
6) Found white stringy stuff inside the intestine. Can be seen in the photos while it is still in the intestine and I removed it and placed it on the blue paper towel. Would this be intestinal parasites?

Looks like there was some sort of growth where the hole was on the clowns side. Would love to hear what everyone else thinks.

http://s1168.photobucket.com/user/SandJ01/library/Maroon Clown