Moving Sump To basement. Plumbing/pump questions

[SeaJay]

I'm moving my sump to the basement and have a couple questions about plumbing. Hoping that other's experience may help me avoid costly mistakes.

I currently have 2 in sump return pumps and a 3/4" pipe for each return. I have a 1" drain from each overflow.

In the basement I will have 1 external pump so that I can turn the return chamber of my sump into a refugium. That pump will have 1" or 1.5" outlet. Should I run a 1" pipe upstairs for the return and split to 3/4" under the tank? Should I run a 1-1/2" pipe for the drain and split it upstairs under the tank? Or is there a benefit of running a dedicated line for each all the way upstairs?

I wouldn't think it would matter if I split upstairs or down or if the drains should be kept completely separate, but I'd like to hear from someone who has done this before.

Also, I think I've narrowed it down to either the Reeflo Super Dart/Snapper Gold or the Iwaki MD-40XT for the pump. Any info on those or input into that decision would be appreciated as well. Reliability, noise, efficiency and customer service comparisons would be helpful.

Thanks!

 

[TLO45]

If I went with one of the two you mentioned I’d do the Iwaki. However personally I’d lean towards a red Dragon or Abyzz. I know they are pricey but you will never need another pump, they are silent, run cool and are programmable. I have used a shed full of pumps through the years and I have NEVER had a pump as well built, silent running workhorse as my Red Dragon!

 

[SeaJay]

If I went with one of the two you mentioned I’d do the Iwaki. However personally I’d lean towards a red Dragon or Abyzz. I know they are pricey but you will never need another pump, they are silent, run cool and are programmable. I have used a shed full of pumps through the years and I have NEVER had a pump as well built, silent running workhorse as my Red Dragon!

I did look at the red dragons and you are right, they are pricey. I've also read a lot that DC pumps aren't ideal for head applications like basement sumps. I'm not cheap, but I am doing a ton of work right now and am trying to be somewhat budget conscious. I'm moving the sump to the basement, plumbing, electrical, new lights, new rockscape, new ATO/AWC setup. Gotta make the budget go around.

That said, I was leaning toward the reeflo, but after reading up on some of the pump threads here, I think the Iwaki will be better suited to my application (and budget).

Getting to that point where I'm just going to order one to alleviate the dizziness that comes from reading in endless circles on forum threads...

 

[madweazl]

I ran separate 1" lines for each and actually have a Snapper/Dart for the return. The pump is relatively quiet and does a good job but the Iwaki is a better option and will out live any pump out there (I'd put an Iwaki against an Abyzz any day of the week if absolute reliability was the goal). The only issue with the Snapper/Dart is the seals do wear out; if you always have a spare on hand it isn't a big deal but it's something you'll never worry about with the Iwaki. Plumbing starts around page 4 of my 150g build thread in the signature if you're interested.

 

[TLO45]

I totally understand but both Abyzz and Red Dragon will push a good amount of head. If dead silence isn’t a concern the Iwaki will be good.

 

[crusso1993]

I'm moving my sump to the basement and have a couple questions about plumbing. Hoping that other's experience may help me avoid costly mistakes.

I currently have 2 in sump return pumps and a 3/4" pipe for each return. I have a 1" drain from each overflow.

In the basement I will have 1 external pump so that I can turn the return chamber of my sump into a refugium. That pump will have 1" or 1.5" outlet. Should I run a 1" pipe upstairs for the return and split to 3/4" under the tank? Should I run a 1-1/2" pipe for the drain and split it upstairs under the tank? Or is there a benefit of running a dedicated line for each all the way upstairs?

I wouldn't think it would matter if I split upstairs or down or if the drains should be kept completely separate, but I'd like to hear from someone who has done this before.

Also, I think I've narrowed it down to either the Reeflo Super Dart/Snapper Gold or the Iwaki MD-40XT for the pump. Any info on those or input into that decision would be appreciated as well. Reliability, noise, efficiency and customer service comparisons would be helpful.

Thanks!

Can you please supply a link to the Iwaki MD-40XT? I cannot seem to find anything online.

 

[madweazl]

MD-40RXT - 1344 GPH Japanese

Why does BRS recommend this? Anytime we need an external pump the Iwaki Japanese motors are our first choice. There are cheaper options that work just fine, however when it comes to noise the Iwaki Japanese external pumps are class leaders and for any area where noise a concern and space is...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

 

[crusso1993]

MD-40RXT - 1344 GPH Japanese

Why does BRS recommend this? Anytime we need an external pump the Iwaki Japanese motors are our first choice. There are cheaper options that work just fine, however when it comes to noise the Iwaki Japanese external pumps are class leaders and for any area where noise a concern and space is...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

Thanks for the link. However, the pump in the link is an Iwaki MD-40RXT and not an MD-40XT. I did find the "RXT" but the OP stated the one he was looking at is an "XT".

 

[madweazl]

Thanks for the link. However, the pump in the link is an Iwaki MD-40RXT and not an MD-40XT. I did find the "RXT" but the OP stated the one he was looking at is an "XT".

It's an RXT.

 

[SeaJay]

Thanks for the link. However, the pump in the link is an Iwaki MD-40RXT and not an MD-40XT. I did find the "RXT" but the OP stated the one he was looking at is an "XT".

Typing on an iPhone. Just missed a letter I guess.

 

[SeaJay]

I went ahead and ordered the MD-40RXT.

 

[Snoopy 67]

SeaJay, I would run the 1.5" pipe.
Carry this up as far as you can before reducing. It does help.

 

[SeaJay]

I ran separate 1" lines for each and actually have a Snapper/Dart for the return. The pump is relatively quiet and does a good job but the Iwaki is a better option and will out live any pump out there (I'd put an Iwaki against an Abyzz any day of the week if absolute reliability was the goal). The only issue with the Snapper/Dart is the seals do wear out; if you always have a spare on hand it isn't a big deal but it's something you'll never worry about with the Iwaki. Plumbing starts around page 4 of my 150g build thread in the signature if you're interested.

Cool. Thanks. I had the snapper/dart gold in my cart, but swapped it out for the iwaki before checkout. Noise isn’t a major concern. It will be in a nook adjacent to my basement workshop.

I Was thinking I would run three 1” lines upstairs. Keep the drains completely separate, but T the returns at the tank. I’ll definitely check out your thread before I decide. It’ll probably be a couple weeks before I get to plumbing anyway.

 

[SeaJay]

SeaJay, I would run the 1.5" pipe.
Carry this up as far as you can before reducing. It does help.

Even with the 1” outlet of the iwaki? The reeflo has a 1.5” outlet, but the iwaki doesn’t.

 

[madweazl]

Cool. Thanks. I had the snapper/dart gold in my cart, but swapped it out for the iwaki before checkout. Noise isn’t a major concern. It will be in a nook adjacent to my basement workshop.

I Was thinking I would run three 1” lines upstairs. Keep the drains completely separate, but T the returns at the tank. I’ll definitely check out your thread before I decide. It’ll probably be a couple weeks before I get to plumbing anyway.

In hindsight, I should have gone flex line for most if not all of it. I still have to box in the drywall cutouts but I've been lazy lately.

 

[madweazl]

Even with the 1” outlet of the iwaki? The reeflo has a 1.5” outlet, but the iwaki doesn’t.

If you have the space, run the 1.5" but if not, the 1" works out OK. What size tank was it? I'm running the 150g with 1" and havent had an issue with flow on the Snapper impeller but may try the Dart just for giggles.

 

[SeaJay]

If you have the space, run the 1.5" but if not, the 1" works out OK. What size tank was it? I'm running the 150g with 1" and havent had an issue with flow on the Snapper impeller but may try the Dart just for giggles.

It’s 135gal tank.

 

[crusso1993]

Typing on an iPhone. Just missed a letter I guess.

No biggie... happens to all of us.

I went ahead and ordered the MD-40RXT.

Without knowing specifics about the tank size, sump size, amount of tank turn over you want or bulkhead(s) used in sump, it's hard to say if the Iwaki will suit your needs. However, being that you are putting the sump in your basement, it is safe to presume you will be running 12ft of head, minimally ( 8 ft from pump to bottom of upstairs floor + 4 feet up and into the tank). This does not account for running an oversized return, splitting of the return or any additional friction caused by extra fittings. At a glance, the MD-40RXT will be undersized.

FWIW - here is a good video on how to calculate the proper sized pump for applications.

 

[madweazl]

No biggie... happens to all of us.



Without knowing specifics about the tank size, sump size, amount of tank turn over you want or bulkhead(s) used in sump, it's hard to say if the Iwaki will suit your needs. However, being that you are putting the sump in your basement, it is safe to presume you will be running 12ft of head, minimally ( 8 ft from pump to bottom of upstairs floor + 4 feet up and into the tank). This does not account for running an oversized return, splitting of the return or any additional friction caused by extra fittings. At a glance, the MD-40RXT will be undersized.

FWIW - here is a good video on how to calculate the proper sized pump for applications.

Even at 12' head you're still pushing 600+ gph which is more than enough through a sump.

 

[ca1ore]

I don’t see size of the tank. Depending upon total head/friction back pressure you may need a bit more than the Iwaki 40. Always best to run as large return piping as you can to reduce friction.