No love for MH?
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Reefcowboy
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I have a frag, definitelly the nicest millie IMO...colored like a sunburst monti...Very nice
Brian1f1
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MH is just too wasteful. The possibly better growth/color some people claim is really incremental and subjective. IMO it’s not worth the grossly higher environmental and financial costs to operate. That’s before you figure in how difficult the heat can be to manage, which often requires a chiller, fans, what not. Evaporation was through the roof with the heat and fans, chillers are expensive and environmentally and economically costly to operate. I switched to LEDs and no longer have any issues with high temps.
Helfish
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Hi! I have a 25 gallon nano reef coming and I am wondering how much a Giesemann Infinity (150w + 4 x 24w T5) would put heat to the tank? My apartment does not have AC and last summer the temperature in the flat went up as high as 33 celsius (91F). Chiller is not an option. Would a fan be enough during the summer time?
Nano can be hard - can you find a 70w ballast to use in that fixture... 70w halides are great nano lights. If you are going to do it, then Infinity is nice since the reflector is smaller and could avoid a lot of light spill and the open top tank should mitigate nearly all heat. I ran 150w over a 29g Biocube with no heat issues, so it is doable if you are smart and want to solve the few problems that come up. I guess that it is not super hot in Finland, so that helps a lot. At 100+ degrees and 100% humidity in the Midwest of the US, fans were all that I ever needed - never any chiller. If you hit a hot spell, you can raise the light up a few inches too - hanging/pendant type of lights are easy to mitigate heat since you can physically move them and still provide light.
Again, heat is a lazy narrative for people who did not want to solve the issues. There can be real problems in South Florida or the Mojave, but outside of there, this can be easily managed without any super expense or inconvenience... if you want to. I guess if you were using a pair of 400w Halides over a 55g tank, then heat could be an issue, but this is a bad-choice, not a problem with the type of lighting - if a pair of Radions could have worked, then so could a pair of 150w Halides with virtually no heat transfer.
Anybody who thinks that color does not matter is welcome into my home if you are ever in Colorado. I am still waiting for the first LED fanboy to come over and admit that their color is better - has yet to happen. Not everybody wants to switch, but they leave knowing that there is another level of color that they have not reached yet. Again, this could get back to level of reefing... might not matter much with easier stuff, but at my level with just acropora and clams, there is a huge difference. This level is not higher, or lower, than other levels just a different level. People hate it when I say this kind of stuff, but it is all done out of love for the people who see the best possible environment for their corals - my apologies to those who it makes mad.
Again, heat is a lazy narrative for people who did not want to solve the issues. There can be real problems in South Florida or the Mojave, but outside of there, this can be easily managed without any super expense or inconvenience... if you want to. I guess if you were using a pair of 400w Halides over a 55g tank, then heat could be an issue, but this is a bad-choice, not a problem with the type of lighting - if a pair of Radions could have worked, then so could a pair of 150w Halides with virtually no heat transfer.
Anybody who thinks that color does not matter is welcome into my home if you are ever in Colorado. I am still waiting for the first LED fanboy to come over and admit that their color is better - has yet to happen. Not everybody wants to switch, but they leave knowing that there is another level of color that they have not reached yet. Again, this could get back to level of reefing... might not matter much with easier stuff, but at my level with just acropora and clams, there is a huge difference. This level is not higher, or lower, than other levels just a different level. People hate it when I say this kind of stuff, but it is all done out of love for the people who see the best possible environment for their corals - my apologies to those who it makes mad.
MnFish1
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I run mine at 100%. I personally don't care for the blue look at all.
There is no real data on either side that one is better than the others. There is no real information that suggests that a given PAR level from a MH is all that different from a PAR level from an LED. (Or if there is I'd like to see it). Otherwise it comes down to personal preference IMHO. I like the way my Radions 'look' on the tank as compared to the bulky metal halide fixtures, they are quieter than my old MH fixtures. I like not having to change the bulbs and I have seen no difference in coral growth. As far as cost - isn't it similar to buying an iPhone or an android phone - people still argue about this on forums? Some people like the look/feel of an iPhone - among other things. In the end, they are both phones.
I tend not to tinker with my lights.
MnFish1
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Personally - I don't see a big difference (this is just my opinion - which is different than your opinion). I see how most Retailers sell coral, and raise it. I personally want things 'simple'. I don't want fans blowing on the top of my sump, or aquarium.
I think you're posts are interesting - they don't make me mad - but - its only your opinion as to the 'best environment' for corals. That said - if you have some information besides 'your tank' or what you think other people's tanks look like - as to why using a metal halide light vs an LED light is better - I'm open to hearing the evidence. Lots of people have lots of opinions as to what makes the best 'color'. from alkalinity to flow to light to supplements, etc.
MnFish1
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@Jay Norris it seems that everyone with an opposing opinion gets a rebuttle from you. I love conversation but these threads always turn into this. I'm glad you love your led lights and I actually like them myself with amazing tanks I've seen. I also love halides and choose to go that route after my wife and I thought long and hard about cost and look. I love discussion don't get me wrong and it's what makes this forum great but it eventually turns into a defending of one light source when all are good and if your happy then that's what matters. Everyone light your tanks how you want and happy reefing
I guess I see it a little differently - I see many posts suggesting that using LED's is bad for corals. That somehow metal halides are a miracle coral grower as compared to LED's. I fully agree with you that (IMHO) both are fine - both have advantages both have disadvantages.
I agree, I like all the lights but only have real experience with halides and T5. I wouldn't count the current marine orbit on my wife's nano led experience, lol. We're setting up a nano soon and using a kessil but the 750xxl will be getting halides, T5 and reefbrite. I feel it happens on all lighting threads, a discussion turned into defending purchases of ones lighting choice.
MnFish1
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Curious - How would that happen? I mean that a heater would cause worse evaporation than halides with a fan? This has nothing to do with the MH/LED discussion - I'm having an evaporation issue I'm trying to figure out lol. Everything I've read/seen suggests that moving air will cause more evaporation than 'still air' - and if the water with the heater is the same temp as the water with the halides - I dont see how it could possible be that a heater could cause more evaporation
In my wife's nano all it had was a heater with led lighting. That tank had more evaporation than the reef tank with halides. I did have a chiller on the reef tank but I think it's silly to think that just because you run halides you'll experience a lot more evaporation.
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Granted I live in WI, but when I made the switch from led to mh I noticed a minimal change in evaporation. I usually topped off every Friday and it seems to have shifted to every Thursday. Dont know if the switch had anything to do with it, but I'm still at filling up my reservoir once a week with both lighting systems
naterealbig
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Stunning shots, and beautiful tank. Thank you for sharing!
naterealbig
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Hey Brian, my Giesemann Spectra in its current configuration is running at 716 watts. This is about 100 more watts than the 6 x XR-15s, or the 3 x Orphek Atlantik that I considered running. In Florida we are talking literally a few extra pennies a day. I have never, ever run a chiller on my halide lit tanks, and I have been using halides since 2002. A nice fan costs me about $9 bucks at target, and is easier for me to install than a phosban reactor..... While the idea certainly sounds nice, I didn't see any noticeable difference in my electricity bill when running G3s (i loved them), and the whole energy savings argument for LEDs is tough for me to swallow.
naterealbig
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+1 to JDAs comments. If the temp in your flat gets up to 91F though, the fans will not help regardless of the light you use. They can not cool your water below ambient temperature. If you cannot sustain a temp lower than 82-83 F in your living areas, a chiller will be a must.
Here in Colorado, we do get some 100 degree days, but with 50s at night, the temp inside of the house never gets much above 76 or maybe 78. We run the attic fan all night with the windows open and then shut it off during the day and let the 60 degree interior air warm up to about 75 until it gets dark. We have AC, but if I can avoid using it, then that helps my pocket and carbon emissions - I bought solar panels for the reefs and my hot tub. I hope that nobody has 91 inside of their home... ouch.
You can evaporative cool below ambient air, but this is not all that efficient nor reliable. Ice Probe nano coolers kinda do this, but with more efficiency.
BTW - here is three months of growth for a Fox Flame. Fox Flame is a fast grower. I will try and get a recent pic soon... this thing is getting big:
[url=https://flic.kr/p/2c745ay]
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You can evaporative cool below ambient air, but this is not all that efficient nor reliable. Ice Probe nano coolers kinda do this, but with more efficiency.
BTW - here is three months of growth for a Fox Flame. Fox Flame is a fast grower. I will try and get a recent pic soon... this thing is getting big:
[url=https://flic.kr/p/2c745ay]
[/url]
