Pro Reef salt from Turkey

[Bugger]

Phosphate of RO/DI water

PHOSPHATE LEVEL of new mixed up tropic marine pro Germany bucket

 

[poidog]

Phosphate of RO/DI water

PHOSPHATE LEVEL of new mixed up tropic marine pro Germany bucket

Wow!

 

[reef_ranch]

Appreciate the response. My concern here is that this is more than just one reefer. When you have well respected community members and/or vendor(s) also experiencing issues, it becomes a trend, not an isolated incident. I truly hope whatever is going on can be figured out and that everyone who has reported issues here gives you the info you need to aid in this.

You understand that “more than one reefer” means absolutely nothing in the context of this analysis. You can find “more than one refer” complaining about every salt ever manufactured. What I’ve read so far demonstrates nothing other than people tend to pile on regardless the evidence actually presented. One reefer complained that all of his corals died because the MN and Fe levels were super high. When he showed the ICP results, they were normal for TM and could not have been the reason for his losses. Rather than look elsewhere in his tank , he said “it must be something undetectable in the salt.” Really?? What’s rational about that? What about the hundreds of other things that can cause a sudden coral die-off?

Each of the complaints I’ve read about the salt have been user error, are explainable, or are not reproducible by TM when the suspect salt is sent to them for analysis. We’re still waiting for the ICP test of fresh TM that claim 300 mg MN. But even if true, do we know whether that has an impact on hit animals?? SBB is going to show ICP tests with high iron. I’ll wait to see those, but if they are within the range Hans says has always been in the salt, then no issue. If substantially higher then I hope he’ll send a sample of the salt in to TM to test themselves.

I have been using pro reef since at least 2010. With a 400g system and regular 15% water changes, I use a lot of it. None of these threads give me any reason to change. Rather, the attention given to these complaints by Lou and Hans only gives me more confidence in the salt.

 

[IKD]

You understand that “more than one reefer” means absolutely nothing in the context of this analysis. You can find “more than one refer” complaining about every salt ever manufactured. What I’ve read so far demonstrates nothing other than people tend to pile on regardless the evidence actually presented. One reefer complained that all of his corals died because the MN and Fe levels were super high. When he showed the ICP results, they were normal for TM and could not have been the reason for his losses. Rather than look elsewhere in his tank , he said “it must be something undetectable in the salt.” Really?? What’s rational about that? What about the hundreds of other things that can cause a sudden coral die-off?

Each of the complaints I’ve read about the salt have been user error, are explainable, or are not reproducible by TM when the suspect salt is sent to them for analysis. We’re still waiting for the ICP test of fresh TM that claim 300 mg MN. But even if true, do we know whether that has an impact on hit animals?? SBB is going to show ICP tests with high iron. I’ll wait to see those, but if they are within the range Hans says has always been in the salt, then no issue. If substantially higher then I hope he’ll send a sample of the salt in to TM to test themselves.

I have been using pro reef since at least 2010. With a 400g system and regular 15% water changes, I use a lot of it. None of these threads give me any reason to change. Rather, the attention given to these complaints by Lou and Hans only gives me more confidence in the salt.

I agree with your logic, but it’s not like this is a new salt on the market (except maybe Turkey source). Many have been using TM for years, so why now are all these people deciding to speak up or report something? It’s not like they are new users or pushing people to some other brand here. So while I understand your point, I do see enough of a warning to be cautious with what is happening for my own 350g tank.

 

[Duffer]

TM Pro phosphate in mix?

I have been using Tropic Marin Pro salt for 1.5 years and have been finding low levels of phosphate after mixing with RODI that tests consistently at 0 phosphate. Has anyone else experienced this over the past 6 months or so? I sent this to TM on their website: I have been using Tropic Marin...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Cell]

You understand that “more than one reefer” means absolutely nothing in the context of this analysis. You can find “more than one refer” complaining about every salt ever manufactured. What I’ve read so far demonstrates nothing other than people tend to pile on regardless the evidence actually presented. One reefer complained that all of his corals died because the MN and Fe levels were super high. When he showed the ICP results, they were normal for TM and could not have been the reason for his losses. Rather than look elsewhere in his tank , he said “it must be something undetectable in the salt.” Really?? What’s rational about that? What about the hundreds of other things that can cause a sudden coral die-off?

Each of the complaints I’ve read about the salt have been user error, are explainable, or are not reproducible by TM when the suspect salt is sent to them for analysis. We’re still waiting for the ICP test of fresh TM that claim 300 mg MN. But even if true, do we know whether that has an impact on hit animals?? SBB is going to show ICP tests with high iron. I’ll wait to see those, but if they are within the range Hans says has always been in the salt, then no issue. If substantially higher then I hope he’ll send a sample of the salt in to TM to test themselves.

I have been using pro reef since at least 2010. With a 400g system and regular 15% water changes, I use a lot of it. None of these threads give me any reason to change. Rather, the attention given to these complaints by Lou and Hans only gives me more confidence in the salt.

There is a big difference between an isolated, single complaint and multiple long time users all experiencing the same issue at the same time from the same source, a new production facility in Turkey.

Here are 4 more reports, hopefully they will confirm the production source.

It's good to find out others are having trouble with Tropic Martin salt too. I've used it for about a year and a half. My last bucket I noticed had a plastic handle instead of metal. And the salt is definitely not the same as the old stuff. It mixes dirty!

Has anyone noticed a difference their tank using Tropic Martin that mixes dirty?

Just found this thread after searching "Tropic marin Pro brown residue". I've been using TM Pro with no problem. My 120gal mixing tank is always clean even when letting the salt sit for weeks. But this last batch (that I probably bought in late Nov) has turned the bottom of my white acrylic tank almost black! The sides are all a tinted a rusty brown. It wipes off easily enough and has no distinct odor that I can tell.

I stock it up so I have two more boxes to use. I'm not sure if I should throw it out.

Has TM responded about this recent quality control issue? Has anyone seen any lab studies on what this contaminant is mostly made of? I'm going to probably do an ICP test and see whats up. I'll share the results

Thanks

I too have nasty black residue buildup on my brute. Hopefully I’ll remember to post a picture of my can. Never had an this issue previously.

I just literally finished a brand new mixing station and batched 55 gallons of TMP in the right cylinder. I’m curious of the residue on brand new containers.

The recent buckets that I received have been fine, but the two that I received late last year left that brown funk residue at the bottom of my buckets. I just went through a crash and I wouldn’t be surprised if the bad salt had a hand in it. Good news is that I think it was limited to a bad run. Would love to hear TM respond. Honesty says a lot about a company.

If nothing changed, what is going on?

 

[Duffer]

I get there is an issue as I think so also and hopefully there will be a correction if needed by tropic marin…but a few dozen folks here that have an issue is probably small compared to how many folks that use tmp thru out the world

 

[Zoa_Fanatic]

I get there is an issue as I think so also and hopefully there will be a correction if needed by tropic marin…but a few dozen folks here that have an issue is probably small compared to how many folks that use tmp thru out the world

A good point but if I were one of the few dozen I honestly would not care how many people have used it with no issues. If I lost my reef to SALT of all things I would be livid. Plus this is a super small sample size. How many people out there are having issues that aren’t even aware of reef2reef?

it’s also been argued that Turkey doesn’t necessarily instill “quality” in peoples minds like Germany does. That’s part of the problem here. It may be that if this salt came from Germany or another “high quality” country even with the issues people would write it off as a “one off” issue.

Edit: I feel like Turkey is a big part of the problem in addition to the actual salt issues. I use Jager heaters exclusively. Some people hate them and have had issues on here but I totally wrote those off as freak accidents because they’re manufactured in Germany and I trust German Engineering.

 

[hsosa]

I have a box of TM that I got from BRS in November unopended it says made in turkey . should I ask brs to exchange the salt to German made I mean thats what I paid for made in Germany not made in turkey im just saying .

 

[Bugger]

The German salt is bad too. Its a supply chain issue.

Brs started promoting the salt and it sold out and they had to get more supplies to fulfill demand and somewhere along the way containments got into their salt.
I would use a salt that tests the salt threw ICP like aqua forrest or red sea. each batch is tested

 

[Drendo]

I have a box of TM that I got from BRS in November unopended it says made in turkey . should I ask brs to exchange the salt to German made I mean thats what I paid for made in Germany not made in turkey im just saying .

Holy crap, no wonder my parameters went whack! Turns out that my bad batches were made in Turkey and the new batch in Germany. I went through over 1,000 ml of Triton Magnesium during my tank crash and haven’t had to add any with the German batch. My alkalinity is also much more stable on my Apex.

My tank crash was brutal and until now I couldn’t figure out what happened. I have such a love/hate relationship with TM. When I can get it and it is the good stuff, it’s perfect for me. I really hope that they can be straight about the quality control issue here on R2R. I’m sure most of us would forgive the error if it is acknowledged abd explained.

 

[drawman]

The German salt is bad too. Its a supply chain issue.

Brs started promoting the salt and it sold out and they had to get more supplies to fulfill demand and somewhere along the way containments got into their salt.
I would use a salt that tests the salt threw ICP like aqua forrest or red sea. each batch is tested

I think you may be right about supply chain but have nothing to base it on other than my own experience. Here's hoping it was just bad batches.

 

[rtparty]

I have a box of TM that I got from BRS in November unopended it says made in turkey . should I ask brs to exchange the salt to German made I mean thats what I paid for made in Germany not made in turkey im just saying .

Does it say in the description you are specifically buying salt made in Germany?

 

[rtparty]

Phosphate of RO/DI water

PHOSPHATE LEVEL of new mixed up tropic marine pro Germany bucket

Do the Hanna checkers even properly read RO water or is it specific to Marine water?

88ppb is .08ppm and hardly an issue (assuming it's even from the salt and not your mixing container.) A 10% water change wouldn't even register a change on your test.

Not arguing something isn't going on here. I've said it multiple times something is clearly up but TM can't track it down. They've been more than open and willing to test every "bad batch" of salt people are claiming.

 

[Bugger]

I don't know if it does not measure phosphorus in fresh water. Yes it was just a regular phosphorus test.
I mix up in a bucket not a vat that never gets cleaned.
0.08 is too high for me not to consider another salt.

 

[rtparty]

I don't know if it does not measure phosphorus in fresh water. Yes it was just a regular phosphorus test.
I mix up in a bucket not a vat that never gets cleaned.
0.08 is too high for me not to consider another salt.

If the Hanna doesn't work on RO water (I suspect it doesn't), then you don't know for sure where the phosphorous came from.

Have you sent in a RO sample to ATI for an ICP test?

 

[Bugger]

No its not my problem to trouble shoot TM issues.
my red sea salt measured 0 phosphorus

 

[Zoa_Fanatic]

In my office I have a 25 gallon lagoon. I’ve run TMP in this system since I set it up about 20 months ago.

I do a 20% water change every 10 days in this tank. The bucket of TMP I’ve used the last 4 water changes is a bucket from Turkey. When I do water changes I always keep 2 gallons of saltwater water from the freshly mixed in case I need quick access to fresh saltwater. The ware I store is never stored longer than 10 days.

I’ve never had any residue in the storage container I store the 2 gallons of freshly mixed TMP in, that is until now.

This picture is what the inside of the container looks like after 4 batches of freshly mixed made in Turkey TMP has been stored in it. Each batch is stored for 10 days, then used as part of a water change then replaced with freshly mixed TMP.
Something has changed with the TMP mix coming out of Turkey. This is first bucket out of Turkey I’ve had and never had any residue previous to this bucket.

That looks like iron residue. My job takes me around landfills and a lot of the runoff contains high iron content. Looks just like that when our containment tanks run dry.

 

[reef_ranch]

I agree with your logic, but it’s not like this is a new salt on the market (except maybe Turkey source). Many have been using TM for years, so why now are all these people deciding to speak up or report something? It’s not like they are new users or pushing people to some other brand here. So while I understand your point, I do see enough of a warning to be cautious with what is happening for my own 350g tank.

First, from what I’ve seen and has been reported, there are maybe 12 people complaining. I don’t think that’s statistically significant. As to those, none have shown super high levels of any element. Even SBB’s ICP came back in line with what TM apparently has always had.

I think it’s fine to be cautious with what you put in your tank. There are other excellent salt mixes out there. I use Red Sea blue bucket from time to time and am happy with it as well. I just don’t see any actual evidence that would make me stop using a salt I have had good success with for many years. I also am concerned that a good company is being dragged unfairly.

 

[reef_ranch]

There is a big difference between an isolated, single complaint and multiple long time users all experiencing the same issue at the same time from the same source, a new production facility in Turkey.

Here are 4 more reports, hopefully they will confirm the production source.









If nothing changed, what is going on?

Four reports out of thousands of users suggests there is something going on with the users rather than the salt. Might be the salt, but if so, why so few reporting this? I went through 400g of TMPR from Turkey since Black Friday when I bought it from BRS and my mixing vat is clean.

I just think we owe TM the benefit of the doubt especially when they have been so responsive and have been unable to duplicate these few reports. Obviously if it’s proven that something went wrong with a batch of salt, I expect TM to recall it and make good on the salt purchased. Until then, I would hope we don’t to conclusions that may unfairly hurt a good company.