Problems with ph and dKH

[Gaines69]

I have a 29gal cube FOWLR tank that I moved Tuesday evening. (My tank was at a friends home for 8 months after Harvey). I kept 15 gal of the tank water and added 14 gal of fresh made salt water that I had mixed in 5 gal buckets with power heads the day before. I decided to test my water today. My ph is running between 7.8-8.0 and my dKH is 17.9 Also NO3 is high at 80 ppm whole NO2 and ammonia are both zero. Should I do a water change or is it to soon after the almost 50% change done during the move? Should I let the tank run a few more days and retest to see what the results are? At this time I only have a pair of clownfish, a pistol shrimp, a peppermint shrimp, two small brittle stars, and hermits and snails. I just changed filter material( carbon and filter pads) last night. Fish are acting fine but I do t want to steer them out more than I already have with the move. Thanks in advance for any suggestions. Also just tested my calcium 400 ppm and phosphates 5.0 ppm. I used IO salt and feet crystals. Could this be the problem?

 

[Crabs McJones]

Dkh of 17.9
Nitrate of 80
400 calcium
5ppm phosphate
That is really high for having added almost half brand new saltwater. How bad were the levels before the mix?? What test kit are you using? Those levels just dont sound right. If they are your going to want to do a series of small water changes over time to bring everything down. Dkh should be between 7 and 12, nitrate should be less than 5ppm phosphate should be .02ppm or less, and calcium should be increased to 420 to 460.

 

[Swoody]

Yeah...everything but the calcium is really askew...is there any way that your test kit reagents are out of date or somehow concentrated by having the lids loose etc...With No3 and Ph4 that high you are going to have a bumper crop of algae real soon! I would do a 30% water change and access my testing kits accuracy before things get out of hand. Of course of you have any corals the dKH is going wreak havoc on them....

 

[Gaines69]

It’s a fish only with live rock aquarium. I’m using an API master reef testing kit. It’s only about three months old. To be honest I’m not sure what the levels were before the move. Like I said aquarium was with someone else for 8 months. It wasn’t possible to go by every day but now that I have my aquarium back I will test on a regular schedule. I am going to retest tomorrow. I’ll also test my tap water. I rent so I am unable to have a ROsystem. There is a place close by that sells filtered water. It’s a 12 step filtration which includes RO so I’ll go get some tomorrow. Fish and inverts are acting normal and tank is crystal clear so I’m not sure what’s going on. I also just put new carbon and new filter cartridges( I’m running a 75 gal hob bio wheel filter) in so I’m hoping it will level off a bit next few days. I’m not opposed to doing water changes I just don’t want to stress the fish so soon after a major move.

 

[Gaines69]

Retested this morning. PH is up to 8.4 and NO3 is down just a little. KH is down to 15 but phosphate is still around 5.0ppm. I double check test kit. Doesn’t expire until 2020. Like I said before it is a pretty new test kit and was kept inside in the same room as the tank. I tested my tap water and phosphate was 1.0 ppm and KH was 7. Could the IO Reef crystals be the problem? Tank is still crystal clear and fish are still very active. I’m going to try a small water change this evening and retest tomorrow morning.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I'd ignore the pH. There's nothing that you should be doing about it.

Did you use tap water?

The Reef Crystals is not 'causing" the problem, but if you used tap water with an alk of 7 with any salt mix, the alk will be too high because it adds to the alk in the salt mix.

Topping off for evaporation with that tap water will also add more alk.

 

[Gaines69]

Guess I’ll be making a trip to water filter station today. Would it be ok to clean out my 5 gal water bottle with vinegar and water because is has been sitting since August after Harvey. 7 months sitting in my old apartment that was flooded and full of mold etc.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Guess I’ll be making a trip to water filter station today. Would it be ok to clean out my 5 gal water bottle with vinegar and water because is has been sitting since August after Harvey. 7 months sitting in my old apartment that was flooded and full of mold etc.

That's a good way to clean mixing barrels.

 

[Gaines69]

I was researching online about high phosphates and high NO3 and someone said that bio wherls on a filter are a bad thing because they are essentially factories for NO3 etc. is this true? I thought they were a good thing because beneficial bacteria lived in them. I’m at a loss as to why my phosphates and NO3 are so high. My KH is height also but ph is good. ( around 8.4. Kinda hard to get an accurate reading on test strips). I really worry about doing another big water change after just doing aprox 50% Tuesday when I moved my tank. I also did filter media change Wednesday. I’m just frustrated and want to get tank stabilized so I can get new fish. My pair of clowns are the only fish I have and my tank looks empty.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Filters that facilitate nitrification (the conversion of ammonia to nitrate) are fine except that they often do not allow for denitrification the way that sand and porous rock surfaces may.

How high is your nitrate?

 

[Gaines69]

Filters that facilitate nitrification (the conversion of ammonia to nitrate) are fine except that they often do not allow for denitrification the way that sand and porous rock surfaces may.

How high is your nitrate?

Nitrate was 15 yesterday. I have quite a lot of live rock and live sand.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Nitrate was 15 yesterday. I have quite a lot of live rock and live sand.

I personally would not do anything special with your filter at that level, except keep it clean.

 

[Gaines69]

I personally would not do anything special with your filter at that level, except keep it clean.

I am changing out my little bag of Purigen today. Hoping that will help with the nitrates. Will do a water change Tuesday ( a week after the last big water change) and just keep an eye on my levels. Thanks

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I am changing out my little bag of Purigen today. Hoping that will help with the nitrates. Will do a water change Tuesday ( a week after the last big water change) and just keep an eye on my levels. Thanks

You're welcome.

Happy reefing.

 

[OriginalUserName]

I was researching online about high phosphates and high NO3 and someone said that bio wherls on a filter are a bad thing because they are essentially factories for NO3 etc. is this true? I thought they were a good thing because beneficial bacteria lived in them. I’m at a loss as to why my phosphates and NO3 are so high. My KH is height also but ph is good. ( around 8.4. Kinda hard to get an accurate reading on test strips). I really worry about doing another big water change after just doing aprox 50% Tuesday when I moved my tank. I also did filter media change Wednesday. I’m just frustrated and want to get tank stabilized so I can get new fish. My pair of clowns are the only fish I have and my tank looks empty.

There is no such thing as a "nitrate factory" in the sense that some use it. Creating nitrate is kind of the point of a filter like a biowheel or liverock. What people should say is that some items such as dirty filter socks that aren't cleaned allow more junk to remain in the system that will eventually be broken down into nitrate. IMHO, biowheels don't really get that clogged with junk.

That said, if you have live rock/sand you probably don't need the wheel.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

There is no such thing as a "nitrate factory" in the sense that some use it. Creating nitrate is kind of the point of a filter like a biowheel or liverock. What people should say is that some items such as dirty filter socks that aren't cleaned allow more junk to remain in the system that will eventually be broken down into nitrate. IMHO, biowheels don't really get that clogged with junk.
.

I don't think dirty filters is the only "explanation".

He's an alternative explanation:

Filters Designed To Facilitate The Nitrogen Cycle.

Filters such as trickle filters using traditional bioballs do a fine job of processing ammonia to nitrite to nitrate, but do nothing with the nitrate. It is often non-intuitive to many aquarists, but removing such a filter altogether may actually help reduce nitrate. Consequently, slowly removing them and allowing more of the nitrogen processing to take place on and in the live rock and sand can be beneficial.

It is not that any less nitrate is produced when such a filter is removed, it is a question of what happens to the nitrate after it is produced. When nitrate is produced on the surface of impermeable media such as bioballs, it mixes into the entire water column, and then has to find its way, by diffusion, to the places where it may be reduced (inside of live rock and sand, for instance).

If it is produced on the surface of live rock or sand, then the local concentration of nitrate is higher there than in the first case above, and it is more likely to diffuse into the rock and sand to be reduced to N2.

In a reef aquarium with adequate live rock, there is little use for a trickle filter, so in general they can be safely removed.

 

[chris jones 105]

When u do your water change vaccume as much of the sand bed as rock's will allow..might help export out ..

 

[Gaines69]

When u do your water change vaccume as much of the sand bed as rock's will allow..might help export out ..

I’m just a little weary about vacuuming my sand bed. A aquacultured mandarin will be added after I have had my tank home and stable for awhile so I don’t want to get rid of the critters etc that live in the sand. I have an awesome cuc and my sand is pretty clean and turned over all the time. With my bristle worm population food that hits the sand bed is goon quickly. I have added another bag of Purigen ( enough for a 100 gal tank) and I will retest water here in a little bit. I think part of the problem is that they were being over fed and that has stopped. My bio load is light right now so I’m just going to keep filters clean and do my weekly water changes and keep a close eye on the parameters and see how it goes.
Thanks for the suggestion

 

[Hockeypunk1]

What is your salinity and what are you testing with? The tap water is definitely the problem. You can hook up an rodi system to your sink and disconnect it when you're done. That being said if you're not keeping coral I worry about it as long as everything in the tank is healthy and you're not growing a ton of algae. Although if you're interested in growing coral in the future you will need to either buy an rodi system or buy rodi water from a fish store.

 

[Gaines69]

What is your salinity and what are you testing with? The tap water is definitely the problem. You can hook up an rodi system to your sink and disconnect it when you're done. That being said if you're not keeping coral I worry about it as long as everything in the tank is healthy and you're not growing a ton of algae. Although if you're interested in growing coral in the future you will need to either buy an rodi system or buy rodi water from a fish store.

I can purchase filtered water at a water station. It’s 12 step filtration and RODI is one of the steps. I can get 5 gal for $1.25. At this time I’m not interested in growing coral. I may one day try a BTA but for now FOWLR is what I’ll sticks with.
Thanks
PS. What did reefers use before RODI became available? Just wondering why it’s so important now. Not trying to be ugly I really am curious.