Purposely making tank cloudier to test bacteria?

[taricha]

also, i thought the spores being dormant and in preservatives was a common fact? Maybe i am wrong?

Not nitrifying bacteria like One & Only, BioSpira etc. They aren't actually spores, and don't need "preservatives" they are just waiting on ammonia. Heterotroph bottled bacteria is often spore-formers.

oh, wait. I forgot something.
If that cloudy water in your video is an actual bacterial bloom, then that water is going to be too oxygen depleted for much nitrification to happen. You can't oxidize ammonia and nitrite to nitrate if the O2 is low.

 

[jDoSe]

Not nitrifying bacteria like One & Only, BioSpira etc. they aren't spores, and don't need "preservatives" they are just waiting on food.

oh, wait. I forgot something.
If that cloudy water in your video is an actual bacterial bloom, then that water is going to be too oxygen depleted for much nitrification to happen. You can't oxidize ammonia and nitrite to nitrate if the O2 is low.

Interesting point. I dont have a way to measure O2, but figured maybe ph would be a decent indicator? It sits around 8.1-8.15. I run lights during the day, but since nothing is in the tank, it’s just radions at 5%. Not much of a ph change during day.

 

[taricha]

Interesting point. I dont have a way to measure O2, but figured maybe ph would be a decent indicator? It sits around 8.1-8.15. I run lights during the day, but since nothing is in the tank, it’s just radions at 5%. Not much of a ph change during day.

Fair enough. If we trust that pH, then a super dense cloudy bacterial bloom consuming a bunch of O2 and elevating CO2 seems less likely than just abiotic precipitation. But I guess that takes us back to a bunch of particles in the water you somehow couldn't filter out and a dead/dud bottle of One and Only.

This is a situation where I would give the unpopular advice to do an NO2 test. Because detecting a small decrease in ammonia from a high level is hard, but detecting the creation of a small amount of NO2 above zero is easy. And it would confirm that you have active (but slow) nitrification actually happening.

 

[Dan_P]

Yah red sea, but i dosed 1ppm and it read exactly 1ppm, then dosed another 1ppm and it was 2ppm.

also, i thought the spores being dormant and in preservatives was a common fact? Maybe i am wrong?

Try Bio-Spira or Fritz Turbo Start. These should elimate ammonia in a matter of days.

 

[jDoSe]

Well, it’s definitely bacteria.
I thought it was just clouding the water, but when i stirred the sand with a pump a bunch of white slime entered the water column.
Also, when the water drained, it looked like a petri dish on my glass with all kinds of crazy bacteria fractals and shapes.

This is one of the few hobby-killers, as I’ve heard about it in the past and there is still no way of getting rid of it.

I tried rinsing the dand, but after 10 rinses, there is still cloudy water/slime comine off the sand. Crazy how in the tank I couldn’t see any of this.

I’ve completely emptied my tank while I contemplate if it’s worth continuing. No matter how much I clean, it’ll just come back.

 

[SlugSnorter]

Well, it’s definitely bacteria.
I thought it was just clouding the water, but when i stirred the sand with a pump a bunch of white slime entered the water column.
Also, when the water drained, it looked like a petri dish on my glass with all kinds of crazy bacteria fractals and shapes.

This is one of the few hobby-killers, as I’ve heard about it in the past and there is still no way of getting rid of it.

I tried rinsing the dand, but after 10 rinses, there is still cloudy water/slime comine off the sand. Crazy how in the tank I couldn’t see any of this.

I’ve completely emptied my tank while I contemplate if it’s worth continuing. No matter how much I clean, it’ll just come back.

nuke it with kanaplex or something, go with a deadly coctail of kanaplex neoplex and rally and youll have a semi-reef safe witches brew of bacterial destruction

also bacteria can outcompete dr tims by taking up the space dr tims needs to anchor too

 

[jDoSe]

Well, i drained the tank and removed everything. Cleaned it really well. Let it dry for a few days occasionally hitting it with the hairdryer on high. Boiled the plastic pieces I could.

Put only the return pump in, nothing else.
Filled up the tank with fresh rodi straight into the tank.

First 24 hours crystal clear.
After 48 hours I can shine a light from the side and see the “smoke” starting to form.
After 72 hours, it is starting to get cloudier from the side without having to use a flashlight…

 

[SlugSnorter]

Well, i drained the tank and removed everything. Cleaned it really well. Let it dry for a few days occasionally hitting it with the hairdryer on high. Boiled the plastic pieces I could.

Put only the return pump in, nothing else.
Filled up the tank with fresh rodi straight into the tank.

First 24 hours crystal clear.
After 48 hours I can shine a light from the side and see the “smoke” starting to form.
After 72 hours, it is starting to get cloudier from the side without having to use a flashlight…

did you remember to rinse with freshwater? honestly I think theres some weird machining crap left inside the tank

 

[jDoSe]

did you remember to rinse with freshwater? honestly I think theres some weird machining crap left inside the tank

It’s 100% freshwater now. No salt.

Rinsed 4 times with tap water. Filled every compartment with tap water and scrubbed really well. Vodka wipe on the parts I could easily reach. Rinsed multiple times with rodi before letting dry.

But it pretty much has to be coming from the tap water.

Also, what is “machining crap”?

 

[SlugSnorter]

Yep, rinsed 4 times with tap water. Filled every compartment with tap water and scrubbed really well. Vodka wipe on the parts I could easily reach.

But it pretty much has to be coming from the tap water.

Also, what is “machining crap”?

Stuff used when a tank or components are being made that should not end up in the final product (machining oils, and metal dust are an example)

 

[jDoSe]

Stuff used when a tank or components are being made that should not end up in the final product (machining oils, and metal dust are an example)

And bacteria is using this? There’s a ton of bacteria, so I would assume there would be a ton of this stuff. I don't see, smell, or feel any of it.
I’ve drained and refilled the tank I think 7 times soo far. I have wiped every surface many, many times.

 

[SlugSnorter]

And bacteria is using this? There’s a ton of bacteria, so I would assume there would be a ton of this stuff. I don't see, smell, or feel any of it.
I’ve drained and refilled the tank I think 7 times soo far. I have wiped every surface many, many times.

Are you 100% its bacteria, and did you try switching out the salt mix yet? take a clear cup (plastic if you want) fill it with tank water, and add isopropyl alcohol and see if it dies

 

[jDoSe]

Are you 100% its bacteria, and did you try switching out the salt mix yet? take a clear cup (plastic if you want) fill it with tank water, and add isopropyl alcohol and see if it dies

I’m not 100% sure of anything, but if it is growing in rodi freshwater with no salt added, I’m not sure what else it could be.

 

[SlugSnorter]

I’m not 100% sure of anything, but if it is growing in rodi freshwater with no salt added, I’m not sure what else it could be.

its growing in the freshwater? i know it sounds odd, but buy some from your lfs and see what happens when you put it in. this is a bizzare situation. If all else fails try the deadly cocktail of stuff i recommended

 

[jDoSe]

its growing in the freshwater? i know it sounds odd, but buy some from your lfs and see what happens when you put it in. this is a bizzare situation. If all else fails try the deadly cocktail of stuff i recommended

Yes, it is growing in 100% freshwater.


I dont think the coctail will do anything as I will just contaminate it in the future with 1-2 bacteria which will grow to millions in a day.

Even if i just consider my brand new 450$ Spectrapure rodi a complete waste, and buy rodi from an lfs, there’s still no way i will ever not contaminate the tank again.

So right now I only have three options. Try find out what the bacteria is and how to kill it, run a uv sterilizer inline with the rodi, or just get out of the hobby.
Even with a uv sterilizer inline with the rodi, theres no way i dont contaminate it with tap water on my hands or equipment eventually.

My water shouln’t be that bad, as it is city water with only 137 tds.

 

[SlugSnorter]

Yes, it is growing in 100% freshwater.


I dont think the coctail will do anything as I will just contaminate it in the future with 1-2 bacteria which will grow to millions in a day.

Even if i just consider my brand new 450$ Spectrapure rodi a complete waste, and buy rodi from an lfs, there’s still no way i will ever not contaminate the tank again.

So right now I only have three options. Try find out what the bacteria is and how to kill it, run a uv sterilizer inline with the rodi, or just get out of the hobby.
Even with a uv sterilizer inline with the rodi, theres no way i dont contaminate it with tap water on my hands or equipment eventually.

My water shouln’t be that bad, as it is city water with only 137 tds.

no, this bacteria is something else man, a little bit of tapwater won't do anything to start any bacterium, 1-2 bacteria cannot just "become 2 billion" without a food source. I don't think the issue is bacteria, if it appears in both fresh and saltwater, It could be a few things, but bacteria is unlikely. How bright is it around the tank? it could be something using the light to bloom.



Also the tank can be sterilized with water dosed with bleach or with diluted alcohol (remove sensitive plastics first) as a last last resort, nothing will survive.

 

[jDoSe]

no, this bacteria is something else man, a little bit of tapwater won't do anything to start any bacterium, 1-2 bacteria cannot just "become 2 billion" without a food source. I don't think the issue is bacteria, if it appears in both fresh and saltwater, It could be a few things, but bacteria is unlikely. How bright is it around the tank? it could be something using the light to bloom.



Also the tank can be sterilized with water dosed with bleach or with diluted alcohol (remove sensitive plastics first) as a last last resort, nothing will survive.

it received almost no light. I can change this and blast it with light to see if it explodes.

It previously exploded to the point i couldn’t see through the tank when i added a small amount of vinegar.

If you read my previous posts, I know it doesn’t use ammonia. Also when i drailed it the tank, there were crazy looking fractals and shapes on the glass that looked like a science petri dish. When i rinsed the sand, a ton of white slime came off.

When i did the deepclean i wiped the surfaces with everclear vodka.

I wish we had a bacteria expert like we have a chemical expert.

 

[jDoSe]

@Randy Holmes-Farley
Any input on what i can do/try next?

tank is completely empty with only a return pump and rodi (no salt). It is still getting cloudy.

I run no air fresheners, candles or sprays of any kind. The only thing that may put off some sort of fragrance is my garbage bags 18ft away; but I can barely smell any citrus at all even with the lid open.

Hefty Trash Bag Drawstring Ultra Strong Tall Citrus Twist - 40 Count - Jewel-Osco

Shop Hefty Trash Bag Drawstring Ultra Strong Tall Citrus Twist - 40 Count from Jewel-Osco. Browse our wide selection of Trash Bags for Delivery or Drive Up & Go to pick up at the store!

www.jewelosco.com

 

[elysics]

Do you have images of the fractals? Sounds more like some chemical forming crystals rather than bacteria
Bacteria usually just look opaque and slimy

 

[jDoSe]

Do you have images of the fractals? Sounds more like some chemical forming crystals rather than bacteria
Bacteria usually just look opaque and slimy

I didnt get a good picture. Was in too big of a rush to drain and clean. Unsure what type of chemical reaction would cause it in rodi water…
I can probably get better pics the next time i drain it. Parts looked like frozen condensation ice shards that grow on your glass, parts were circular. Google “bacteria petri”. That’s what it looked like.