What does this mean for my cycle and what do I next?

[brandon429]

Don't take that example above of disease issue lightly, it's the absolute #1 thing most likely to destabilize your system (if all the fish die from preventable disease they can crash a tank)

The cycle was the easy part it's the tedious disease prep that gets everyone. It's especially needed in dry start systems. The disease forum here has the quarantine and fallow steps you'll need for every added item into the tank... including corals, snails etc so they don't bring in the fish disease on their wet surfaces.

The initial cycle wasn't going to kill your fish, we don't have any examples of that on the site that I know of... it's the skipping disease preps that does the delayed harm. Even if we took 3 more months to over cycle the tank, that can't help in disease preps at all.

Still do the full water change. Don't load up on stuff until you're versed on disease prep. It's OK to add corals and snails first if you want, but if you add fish without preps that's really going to challenge your system in a few months delayed per the disease forum.

Read this thread about order of ops to avoid disease issues, it covers fallowing the whole tank at once vs in portions as you add life to it. You can see the standout detail is that fish go in last, not first, for ideal preps.

Has anyone done coral/inverts only and no fish at first?

Fish seem to be the main cause of disruption in a display tank, given the current circumstances in the hobby with pests (ich, velvet, parasites, etc.). I have been in this hobby for 18 years, and the amount of pests that are showing up lately is much more (could also be the fact that we have...

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[Roman'sReef]

I will be posting s

I will be uploading a tank pic shortly

So there has been no increase in anything.

 

[brandon429]

That's enough surface area to do the job. Simply run the water change as linked in the example thread and your results will be the same, you can build a reef. If you skip disease preps posted in the fish disease forum stickies, expect the results shown in each help post by the first part of next year. 6-8 mos is the average delay time to disease onset from skipping all preps and no matter how long you take to cycle, those will be the results.

 

[Roman'sReef]

That's enough surface area to do the job. Simply run the water change as linked in the example thread and your results will be the same, you can build a reef. If you skip disease preps posted in the fish disease forum stickies, expect the results shown in each help post by the first part of next year. 6-8 mos is the average delay time to disease onset from skipping all preps and no matter how long you take to cycle, those will be the results.

Alright I will do a water change and apart from that what else

 

[brandon429]

You get to choose how you want to handle disease preps. At least read through some work in the disease forum to watch how Jay fixes those tanks after the fact, consider the steps the reefer took to wind up in that forum. True disease prevention research will take days of reading to gather options.

For an easy start to the concept of fallow preps, read this easy thread as an example of smart disease preps. It's not the only way, but it's a smart way especially among options to do nothing at all other than add fish immediately to a dry start reef.

Has anyone done coral/inverts only and no fish at first?

Fish seem to be the main cause of disruption in a display tank, given the current circumstances in the hobby with pests (ich, velvet, parasites, etc.). I have been in this hobby for 18 years, and the amount of pests that are showing up lately is much more (could also be the fact that we have...

www.reef2reef.com

This forum we're in here, New tanks forum, has the most cycles on the site. Scroll back as many pages as you want and try to find fish dying at the start of a cycle.

Then go into the disease forum and pick people who posted for help, click their avatar select find all threads. Go to their first post on the tank, that allows you to date the build and get an idea of outbreaks in 6-8 month tanks... the majority on any page pretty much

You can see by simple search organization your fish aren't risked at the start, bottle bac is that good, so good you can scroll twenty pages of new tank posts here and not find pattern startup losses

But you can see after months of skipping fallow preps and adding corals, snails, crabs, without any preps the fish start to die in half a year for the vast majority. That's why the thread above is a smart option, it allows you to build a 90% completed reef and fallow it all at once before adding quarantined fish... this is a strong disease prevention effort. Adding fish first, which is what most do here, means all the stuff they add after is a disease vector for the tank. The rest of the study and reading and choice is yours, what I do is just name cycle close dates/ state the time your tank can carry a basic starting load.

Any questions on disease prep after you self- learn the concepts by directed self study should be posted in the disease forum so you get Jay's input vs those who may confuse you by stating they skipped disease preps and nothing bad happened.

 

[Spare time]

Seriously, just give it time.

 

[brandon429]

If you continue testing with api after your water change, expect misreads to rule your reefing start

You'll focus on a false stall and put disease study on the backburner

Search 'api ammonia misread' on Google

See how many hundreds of thousands of problems there are with it? You are done cycle testing after the water change and into being ready to add things. Your selected disease plan controls when and what you add.

None of the things I'm mentioning are new info, searches will show these stated themes ten years or older in the forums. Time to self read and select and study a few more days before choosing what to add at the start.

Read this article on biosecurity

Biosecurity

A short introduction to aquarium biosecurity

www.reef2reef.com

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

So there has been no increase in anything.

Add a bottle of Fritz Turbo Start!!

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

If you continue testing with api after your water change, expect misreads to rule your reefing start

This is simply not true! API is not as PRECISE as other tests, giving you a range instead of an exact number (or smaller range), but they are very reliable tests!

Search 'api ammonia misread' on Google

Yes. As we all know, Google is the best way to do research , lol!!

As has already been discussed, API reads total ammonia, so once a tank is cycled (i.e. producing nitrates), any result between 0 and 0.25 on the API ammo test can be considered 0 free (harmful) ammonia.

Now, I do recommend getting more precise nitrate and phosphate tests (along with alk/mg/cal) once you have coral, but I'm sick of this "API is the boogyman" rhetoric!

 

[Spare time]

This is simply not true! API is not as PRECISE as other tests, giving you a range instead of an exact number (or smaller range), but they are very reliable tests!


Yes. As we all know, Google is the best way to do research , lol!!

As has already been discussed, API reads total ammonia, so once a tank is cycled (i.e. producing nitrates), any result between 0 and 0.25 on the API ammo test can be considered 0 free (harmful) ammonia.

Now, I do recommend getting more precise nitrate and phosphate tests (along with alk/mg/cal) once you have coral, but I'm sick of this "API is the boogyman" rhetoric!

I have used API tests for years when I worked at an LFS and its not uncommon for bacteria in a bottle to take about a week or two to drop the ammonia reading and nitrite reading to zero. The API test kits absolutely do show a change over time. The problem is that the 0.25 and 0.00 color are too similar to be distinguished by a lot of people.

If someone wants to argue that their random internet examples of tanks they are not working with is evidence of them not working, then I can counter that by all of the times I have seen the test kits work as I have mentioned. It is also true that people will not post when they don't have a problem, thus leading to a bias in data as to what people are actually seeing with their test kits. This is the problem when being an internet helper vs someone who has actually had experience in person doing these with different bottles of bacteria and with API tests.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Stop adding ammonia and add a good bacteria like Fritz Turbo Start.

Actually, with your ammonia levels still so high today, I'm changing my recommendation. You clearly added too much ammonia (not uncommon with the Dr. T method) and need to manually bring that down. I can't recall the size of your tank but I recommend doing a large water change (50% if possible), then adding Fritz Turbo Start, and test again a couple days later.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I'd add a better (faster ) type of bacteria, and not do a water change unless you may have added more than 8 ppm of ammonia.

Not all Cycling Bacteria are created equal. Who's who, and what do they need?

My hypothesis is that there are very different types of Bacteria that are being used to "cycle" tanks to prevent ammonia accumulation, and it's not entirely clear which products contain which group, and it's also poorly understood what the requirements are for one of these groups to do their...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Roman'sReef]

Randy and eeye you guys are recommending me different things so I am going to dose some more turbo start and go from there.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Randy and eeye you guys are recommending me different things so I am going to dose some more turbo start and go from there.

Follow Randy's advice over mine, always

 

[jda]

Just add the bacteria and wait until the ammonia color trends downward. I would just walk away from the tank for 3-4 days and then test again as the weekend comes around. This is not some sort of differential equation, but it does take time. If you give it enough time, nearly anything that you do will work out. Take a deep breath and stuff... you are fine.

As an aside, advice from people here to help you is always better than advice from people here to help themselves or tell you how smart that they are.

 

[TheDuude]

Save $ on bottled bacteria and do nothing.

Turn off those lights and forget about it for a couple weeks. Patience is key in reef keeping

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Randy and eeye you guys are recommending me different things so I am going to dose some more turbo start and go from there.

That is correct. You will often see different opinions on what is best or what solution to pick from several available.

Many problems have a lot of possible solutions, like asking someone how to drive from NY to San Francisco.

Many of the answer will be OK, and some may be flat out wrong. As a learning hobbyist, it's a chore for you to decide where and how to get advice and make the many decisions needed to keep a reef tank.

 

[Roman'sReef]

Really appreciating the help from everyone. I'm goin to step aside from the tank for couple of days and will update you guys in next couple days, in the mean time should I finally turn on my skimmer?

 

[jda]

Always yes on the skimmer. The gas exchange is important, IMO. Some folks might tell you to turn it off to not skim stuff out of the water, but not only is this probably a bad idea in general, you can also just use it to bubble and exchange gases and not collect anything.

 

[Roman'sReef]

Always yes on the skimmer. The gas exchange is important, IMO. Some folks might tell you to turn it off to not skim stuff out of the water, but not only is this probably a bad idea in general, you can also just use it to bubble and exchange gases and not collect anything.

Thank you, I will be turning on the skimmer tmrw its getting late for me now haha. Any tips ive never had a skimmer before, mine is one of the nyos quantum.