Dollar dollar bills

[SebastianReefer]

Market prices, supply and demand. I never buy the new "whatever it is", when it first comes out at an exaggerated price. I have the means andI could have picked up a WD earlier, and paid 200-300, now meh, under 100. At my age you will learn the most important lesson, patience. I did not pay 2000.00 for a new TV, waited for technology to push it under a grand. I will likely pick up a WD now that they are reasonable. There will always be a market for high end corals, TV's whatever, bless them, just not me...

I feel the same I have the money but I won’t pay that it’s insane it’s just sad to see how the hobby has become in some ways and I see people fragging corals with only one or two branch’s idk maybe I’m just old

 

[SebastianReefer]

Ok, pal. It was exactly the point of the thread. Why are corals so expensive? I’m sorry. Was this just a thread for poor/cheap people to whine because they can’t have the frags they want and others pay for?

I’m not poor nor cheap but tring to recoop all your money back from one sale is just greed I have plenty of money but that doesn’t mean I’m going to spend 1500 on frag that may or may not be an inch and some people are happy to pay that more power to them I understand everyone needs to make money but there is ways to do that without killing the hobby

 

[SebastianReefer]

Punctuation

??!!! oh

 

[SebastianReefer]

I like your mentality.
Wish their were more like you where I live.
I know a few people and have got my best frags from them vs lfs.
I dont have any high end corals, well a WD nub thats the size of a silver dollar now.
Not going to pay high dollar for a 1/4" nub at the lfs.
When it comes to hobbys its pay to play just like any other one.
Get what you can afford and be happy.
[/QUOT

I see your point, and I don’t think we’re in disagreement on those facts. However, a relatively small hobby such as this doesn’t really lend itself to comparisons with massive agriculture operations. Scarcity and perception of value are going to have a large effect. A head of lettuce is a head of lettuce is a head of lettuce. The same cannot be said for different species and morphs of coral.

OP came across as just whining that prices are too high and they don’t want to pay it. It still doesn’t change the fact that others will, and are, paying it. If nobody did, the prices would drop due to surplus and lack of demand.

i wasn’t whining I can buy any coral I want I choose not to I’ve only been back in the hobby 3 years from being over 20 years ago but some people are so smart they miss the whole point and have no idea what I’m talking about far from whining.

 

[SebastianReefer]

I think you’re missing something. If there’s a market for something, people will try to capitalize on it. Just because you won’t pay for a frag doesn’t mean someone else won’t. If you’re concerned about prices, there are plenty of inexpensive corals out there that you can choose from.

p.s. Punctuation is a good thing.

I have all high end corals I just don’t pay top dollar for them can I yes I can buy any one I want but there is no need for it

 

[Spieg]

 

[cshouston]

Bam that’s exactly my point when if one was thinking like a business man you cut back the price and sell hundreds more frag which equals more customers that come back for more coral instead of selling one or two outrageous frags

You obviously have no education in economics, because as illustrated by this comment, you clearly don’t understand elasticity of demand. Demand for corals in this small market is not highly elastic. If you decrease prices, you’re not going to create much greater demand because the consumer base is already fairly small. You’ll sell roughly the same number of frags, but for a lower price, and just hurt yourself.

 

[Fish_Sticks]

You obviously have no education in economics, because as illustrated by this comment, you clearly don’t understand elasticity of demand.

That combined with the fact that people are only going to buy something once, grow it out, and then sell it themselves locally.

I prefer to sell whole colonies locally, rather than frags, to solve the buying once problem. After a few years, I've seen my same stuff grown out and posted for sale on FB Marketplace and craigalist.

 

[cshouston]

I have all high end corals I just don’t pay top dollar for them can I yes I can buy any one I want but there is no need for it

 

[Juniorh2r]

Well if anyone has any high end frags and ships let me know

 

[cshouston]

I’m not poor nor cheap but tring to recoop all your money back from one sale is just greed
...
I understand everyone needs to make money but there is ways to do that without killing the hobby

If the price of a frag is what the market will bear, there is nothing wrong with someone selling a frag at the same price. Once supply increases, the price one can demand will drop.

Nobody is “killing the hobby”. There is a market for high-end frags, but that isn’t somehow making the market for regular, classic corals just disappear. There’s a LOT of cheap coral out there for anyone to buy if they don’t want to spend on the “designer” stuff.

Your argument just stinks of “I’m old school and better than all this newfangled high-end coral stuff.” Good for you.

Learning how to use commas and periods will make it much easier to read and understand you. Maybe then your opinions will have a bit more gravity to them, but until then, they just read like the ramblings of an uneducated simpleton.

 

[Lizbeli]

Hobby is expensive in general. Buy what you like and can afford. No one is forcing you to pay top dollar. What someone does with their frags or how they price it is their own business. If someone is willing to pay for it then so be it! We all know what it takes to grow these corals- the effort and even general maintenance costs adds up.

That said, I have some corals I will be fragging soon. Ill likely never sell anything for “retail” price to local reefers. If you are someone looking for deals, join a club. I have had good experiences so far with my club. People are always posting corals for sale which are pretty much always cheaper than buying online. I have gotten freebies almost every time. Unfortunately, most of my coral in the new tank are still frags, so I don’t have the ability to add freebies.

 

[stephj03]

High end coral frags is also a hobby, let ppl that are into that be in to it, they're not bothering you.

At this point there's no shortage of very nice corals that have been out a long time and can be had for entry level prices.

How long someone grows out a frag before selling is kind of a silly thing to hold against anyone.

It's not my thing but why hate on someone else bc their hobby is different than yours?

It's such an incorrect position that any of the premium offerings (gear and livestock) pose a threat to the hobby.

It's the exact opposite. Those premium offerings expanded the reach of the hobby by accessing a luxury oriented clientele to the hobby.

If paying luxury prices for luxury items isn't your thing, stick to Oregon tort/pink lemonade/premium frags from friends. And let others be happy paying for luxury and early adoption.

 

[Juniorh2r]

Well me personally ill try to find deals if possible but if I really want it I'll pay for it

 

[Ksull72487]

Reefkeeping has reached a level of knowledge and 'ease-of-getting' into... more and more people are able to have a reef, thanks to the wealth of good reads online, and advancements in equipment.

Some might say running a reef is easy, now.

With that ease in operation, more and more people are looking for coral, thus the prices have gone waaaaay up.

Just wait till restrictions tighten up on wild caught fish and coral - then things are REALLY going to get expensive.

Notice... the first big spike in prices occurred just after LED lighting became available and commonplace a few years ago.

I agree with this! Covid also has drove prices up. Not as much comes in. People are trying charge $25 bucks for a ball of Chaeto. But then again I got started in 2010. Back in the days when Nano Reefing was brave. Today it has gotten easier. I’m always trying to cut costs on those tanks. You invest less you put in less take care of it and do a lot of water changes.

Nano Reefing is responsible for a lot of it. My Biocube with flourescent bulbs fully stocked didn’t cost what some people charge today. GSP costs. They should give that away for free.

The reason I blame Nano Reefing. It’s all I do. Small place etc. I drive an M2 sure I could afford a bigger tank. No room. But what happens is these All In Ones get better and better and better. It drives the new guy to the hobby and some succeed some don’t. Personally I love Nano Reefing. I’ve gotten out and back in once or twice. But every time I go back in I’m constantly testing things figuring out ways to do it cheaper. Lol.

 

[Ksull72487]

It’s always gonna be dollar bills. I think everybody and their grandma wanted a salt water tank growing up. Some couldn’t afford it. The technology gets better and so do the AIOs boom people decide to get their feet wet. Plus Covid people got bored did some cheap AIOs shipments didn’t come in and still aren’t. Most these AIOs today and their sizes. They didn’t exist in 2010. When I decided to jump into the hobby. I was literally told it’s going to fail. 4 tanks later none of them crashed. Spent too much time researching lol. What happens with me. Maybe I move or decide I’m bored with it. I post a bunch of crap for sale. Then the next guy gets in or gets a part he’s missing lol. So I constantly try to figure out ways to do a tank cheaper and cheaper. As Nanos really aren’t long term anyways. I just never had the room for a large tank. Plus my land lords would kill me. They fear water damage.

But these AIOs. How many was their in 2010. Hardly any and I think the BioCube by oceanic was like $500 with out the stand before coral life came in. Today you could be saltwater ready for as little as $150 bucks. So more people go in the corals and fish prices go up.

Might I add the glass gets thinner and thinner too. Lol.

Anyways that’s my 10 years in the hobby and out. Everytime I come back or do something has changed. Nano Reefing is a big factor. I’ll bet you. $1,000 most people going into the hobby today start with a Nano.

And somebody said something about as soon as LEDs came out. Yup. Same time period. My M2 has led accents but still the good old Xenons on the main light. Yeah LEDs went with this curve. You don’t gotta switch out bulbs yearly now. Finding an Acintic blue for an old biocube probably pretty tough. Lol. Just convert to LED. So that alone will draw consumers.

Theirs a ton of factors. But the Nano AIO is one of the biggest. Cuz my first tank was a Nano. But it wasn’t meant to be one.

 

[sawdonkey]

You obviously have no education in economics, because as illustrated by this comment, you clearly don’t understand elasticity of demand. Demand for corals in this small market is not highly elastic. If you decrease prices, you’re not going to create much greater demand because the consumer base is already fairly small. You’ll sell roughly the same number of frags, but for a lower price, and just hurt yourself.

I generally don’t disagree with what you’re saying in this thread, but what you’re saying here isn’t true for me (Masters in finance). I sell a ton of frags because I sell cheap and I barely even try to sell. Just locally, no shipping, just on my local forum, no facebook. I like hooking people up. I sold $1,500 in the last 30 days, but that was to about a dozen people and probably 60 frags or so. People buy from me because I sell big chunky frags for less than half of retail. If my prices were higher, I wouldn’t sell 1/3 of that.

By the way, I have a fully grown out SPS tank with big colonies, so this type of selling barely dents my colonies.

 

[cshouston]

I generally don’t disagree with what you’re saying in this thread, but what you’re saying here isn’t true for me (Masters in finance). I sell a ton of frags because I sell cheap and I barely even try to sell. Just locally, no shipping, just on my local forum, no facebook. I like hooking people up. I sold $1,500 in the last 30 days, but that was to about a dozen people and probably 60 frags or so. People buy from me because I sell big chunky frags for less than half of retail. If my prices were higher, I wouldn’t sell 1/3 of that.

By the way, I have a fully grown out SPS tank with big colonies, so this type of selling barely dents my colonies.

I appreciate the real world data. I’m sure you’ve run the numbers. Raising prices will naturally lower sales volume, but is the greater margin going to compensate? In your case, I would assume “no”, and you’re doing what’s best for your business.

In the case of the big volume sellers, with large farming operations, I’m sure the calculus is completely different. I don’t disagree in principle that small time hobbyists don’t need to charge volume retailer prices, but I stand by my assertion that pricing is supported by the market.

 

[Hugo’s_Reef]

I dont like to pay retail to a hobbyist! I just bought these 12 corals for $100 - TOTAL:
BC Aquaqtic Man Table, BC Sun God Prostrata, Vivids Sonic Boom, Red Millie, SC Orange Passion, BC Blue Ghost, BC Wonder Melon, CC Dark Knight, RC Poison Envy, BC Lemon Hammer, Ultimate Purple Monster, Pink w/yellow tip acro,

Me looking for this killer deal haha...

 

[chaostactics]

Some clubs have created SWAP ( share the wealth and propagate) threads where it's a give one take one system to spread stuff around the local clubs.