help with sand issues

Wiz · Jul 31, 2015

Breakthecycle2 said:
Y're picture. Who told you it was Dino's?

That pic I just googled dinos. But I had them. And that Is exactly what it looked like on the sandbed. There were also streamers coming off of all my rock and corals. And it grew at a much faster rate than cyano. Did you see the defanitions I posted? If you don't believe dinos look like that, then what is your impression of them? Do you have a pic?

Wiz · Jul 31, 2015

This is cyano in my opinion

Breakthecycle2 · Jul 31, 2015

Wiz said:
This is cyano in my opinion

This picture is what your original picture looks like when flow is added. My tank looked like that and the picture you posted. They just kept coming and growing. I was so sure it was dino's, I had made a plan for someone to hol my livestock while I was going to break down and clean the whole tank. After making many posts on this forums and everyone saying it was cyano, I decided to have my LFS take a look under the microscope. It was cyano. I treated with chemiclean twice and it burned it all off the rocks (turned white), but left the sandbed with it. I left it and did massive 80 gallon water changes every 4 days-7 days. I then started treating with MB7 bacteria and then add more flow. It has completely gone away now. I also was would Google pictures and that sane picture I came across multiple times. I'm lucky enough that my LFS (one of them) has two marine biologists on staff. They told me Dino's are almost always green or greenish in color.

Wiz · Jul 31, 2015

[QUOTE"Breakthecycle2, post: 2387954, member: 29666"]This picture is what your original picture looks like when flow is added. My tank looked like that and the picture you posted. They just kept coming and growing. I was so sure it was dino's, I had made a plan for someone to hol my livestock while I was going to break down and clean the whole tank. After making many posts on this forums and everyone saying it was cyano, I decided to have my LFS take a look under the microscope. It was cyano. I treated with chemiclean twice and it burned it all off the rocks (turned white), but left the sandbed with it. I left it and did massive 80 gallon water changes every 4 days-7 days. I then started treating with MB7 bacteria and then add more flow. It has completely gone away now. I also was would Google pictures and that sane picture I came across multiple times. I'm lucky enough that my LFS (one of them) has two marine biologists on staff. They told me Dino's are almost always green or greenish in color.[/QUOTE]
Dinos In my research are never green. And the cyano can get streamers if pushed with flow but not the air bubbles that pull the dinos off the sand. The bubbles are how dinos spread. If you look at the first pic you can clearly see there is not much flow which alone gos against your assesment. But I assure you that I have done much research on dinos and that I have had them. And they are brown with tiny air bubbles that look like airballoons that are attached to streamers of the brown lifting it into the water column. Any amount of research on the net as well as the posts of people fighting it on this sight or others will back up my assesment. Again not to say I am defanitly right but after talking with you and in consideration of all my research and experience with dinos. I will agree to disagree and leave it at that. Happy reefing

Wiz · Jul 31, 2015

Also I just looked at your thread breakthecycle and what you showed pics of is cyano in my opinion. It looks just like this authers. It does not have streamers or air bubbles.

Breakthecycle2 · Jul 31, 2015

Wiz said:
Also I just looked at your thread breakthecycle and what you showed pics of is cyano in my opinion. It looks just like this authers. It does not have streamers or air bubbles.

No, but I did. They were long, stringy, brown and had air bubbles attached to it.

Wiz · Jul 31, 2015

I seem to have been wrong about color. I appolagize. Exactly why I don't say anything 100%. But they are most commonly brown. Check out this articl by our own randy holmes farley

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-11/rhf/index.php#1

elagui · Jul 31, 2015

should i i just try chemiclean?

Breakthecycle2 · Jul 31, 2015

Wiz said:
I seem to have been wrong about color. I appolagize. Exactly why I don't say anything 100%. But they are most commonly brown. Check out this articl by our own randy holmes farley

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-11/rhf/index.php#1

Those are the pictures I go by. If you compare those to what you posted, there is a clear difference. Like I said, I treated my tank for cyanos, not dino's and they went away.

elagui · Jul 31, 2015

Breakthecycle2 said:
Those are the pictures I go by. If you compare those to what you posted, there is a clear difference. Like I said, I treated my tank for cyanos, not dino's and they went away.

how did you treat your cyano?

Breakthecycle2 · Jul 31, 2015

. And the cyano can get streamers if pushed with flow but not the air bubbles that pull the dinos off the sand. The bubbles are how dinos spread. If you look at the first pic you can clearly see there is not much flow which alone gos against your assesment. [/QUOTE said:
Not sure what you mean by this? What I said was, not much flow causes cyano to grow up off the sand, when "weak" flow is added, it blows over and loses the air bubble.

Breakthecycle2 · Jul 31, 2015

elagui said:
how did you treat your cyano?

I first used chemiclean, twice. It cleared off all the rocks, but left the sand untouched. I have a 250 system, so I did two 80 gallon water changes overt he course of week, maybe a little more. I then started treating with MB7.The thing that really seamed to do it was, I ditched my MP 40's and added a Gyre 150.

elagui · Jul 31, 2015

Breakthecycle2 said:
I first used chemiclean, twice. It cleared off all the rocks, but left the sand untouched. I have a 250 system, so I did two 80 gallon water changes overt he course of week, maybe a little more. I then started treating with MB7.The thing that really seamed to do it was, I ditched my MP 40's and added a Gyre 150.

i have a 50 gallon 24x24x20 with 2 mp10s

Breakthecycle2 · Jul 31, 2015

elagui said:
i have a 50 gallon 24x24x20 with 2 mp10s

Ill be honest. I was the biggest Vortech fan, up until I bought my Gyre 150 a few weeks ago. In my opinion I would sell the MP 10's and get the Gyre 130.

elagui · Jul 31, 2015

Breakthecycle2 said:
Ill be honest. I was the biggest Vortech fan, up until I bought my Gyre 150 a few weeks ago. In my opinion I would sell the MP 10's and get the Gyre 130.

lol i had one and i wasnt a fan i feel like they work better for long tanks not cubed tanks no matter how slow i ran it it would blow my sand and i dont use small grain sand.

Breakthecycle2 · Jul 31, 2015

elagui said:
lol i had one and i wasnt a fan i feel like they work better for long tanks not cubed tanks no matter how slow i ran it it would blow my sand and i dont use small grain sand.

Do you have a cyano problem?

elagui · Jul 31, 2015

i think so. Im the one who started this thread.

Breakthecycle2 · Jul 31, 2015

elagui said:
i think so. Im the one who started this thread.

Oh.lol. I would add more flow. The problem with Vortech's is, they do not cover the whole the tank. I would go back to the Gyre.

Bryan47 · Aug 1, 2015

Ok here is your solution.
Go to your LFS and get red slime remover. It usually comes in a powder in what looks like a prescription bottle just only an inch tall bottle. It's like $18 and has worked wonders for me on many occasions. If it is Cyano you will see recessions witching 24 hours and I believe after 48 you dose again? Not positive on that. But then you don't risk harming anything in your tank if it is Cyano.

If you dump in peroxide and something goes wrong and to boot it doesn't get ride of what's on your sand bed, you wouldn't be a happy camper... (reefer). If the red slime doesn't work then no harm done and you can rule out Cyano and you will know Dinosaur Flag Pilates or however you pronounce it is your problem.

And Wiz is doing right by his name, that's one thing you need to figure out, you could have 30 of us say it's Cyano and one guy says its something else and don't be surprised if it's what the one person said and not the 30. It's a hobby of science but a lot of the things we do are based on experience and not hard cut science.

My Cyano bubbles also but not like the pictures of dinos. It's almost like air bubbles trying to escape syrup.

And the hobby has a hazing faze where you get slammed with Algae and then Cyano and everything under the sun, only the truest of reefers make it through!

brandon429 · Aug 1, 2015

Regarding the risk of peroxide and its dangers, how much danger is shown in the multi page peroxide thread stickied at the top? They are all dumping it in to try and effect dinos...5 yrs worth now

Peroxide isnt indicated for this cyano issue but its not harmful to use in the dilutions we use. I realize not everyone agrees, but the assertion no longer lines up with consistent outcomes. It is simply too diluted even in larger doses to wreak the havoc originally guessed it would cause, and it fixes too many problems to be discounted like it was in the early days. The way to long term fix this cyano issue is to fix the deep sand bed incorrect grain size that houses the fuel that feeds the cyano. All else is bandaid.

You can either use or not use peroxide in the known safe 1:10 ratio and it won't do anything to your tank other than kill or not kill an intended target.