thinking about giving up

davocean · Oct 8, 2018

HB AL said:
Thats not a true statement, ive been doing this for 30+ years and have never run a qaurantine tank. But i do buy all my fish from the same lfs, who obviously sell healthy specimens. Just added this clown trigger 5 days ago, float and plop.

To me this is no different than saying you've been driving all your life w/out wearing a seat belt, you've just been lucky and have not crashed yet.
Relying on luck is not being equally responsible as those that practice safe reef keeping and QT new fish

HB AL · Oct 8, 2018

davocean said:
To me this is no different than saying you've been driving all your life w/out wearing a seat belt, you've just been lucky and have not crashed yet.
Relying on luck is not being equally responsible as those that practice safe reef keeping and QT new fish

It’s not luck it’s many years of experience, velvet got me 20+ years ago. Ich is no big deal as I have figured out things that I can do to help the fish fight it off with there immune system and suffer no losses. Although I haven’t seen ich in my tank since my yellow tang had it 28 months ago. Still going strong and no deaths in the 30 months this tank has been running.

kennydoll · Oct 8, 2018

the recent sick fish who wiped out my tank again had nothing to do with the lfs. i understand that. and maybe it’s “irresponsible” but i know tons of people who keep fish with a quarantine system. and believe it or not, i work at a pet store, inthe aquatics department where i specialize in the keeping of freshwater and marine fish. i have kept fish with no problems for almost two years, until this summer when my fish all got velvet. and it’s only in this tank. my 20 gallon? PERFECT. my 55 gallon? PERFECT. my 125, where i do water changes every week, and don’t add a fish in unless i know it’s compatible with the ones i already have, still manages to end up with problems. and it wasn’t a problem until i got that naso. the pet store where i work, isn’t allowed to dose copper in their systems. in fact, i know two other LFS, both who’ve been out of business, who didn’t dose copper either. my 55 gallon tank only has all the fish i listed that are healthy right now and i’ll say that the quality of water is perfect and fish are perfect. i devote so much time and money and research into these tanks because it’s what has made me happy for so long.

the naso tang, who was the first to get sick, yes that may have been my fault for not quarantining but he was rather large, and would be extra stressed in my 20 gallon QT, wouldn’t he? and keep in mind, this is the same lfs that has mischarged me on multiple occasions. i understand completely that it’s a learning experience, i understand completely that it’s hard and sometimes our mistakes is what makes the project turn out the best in the end. but i didn’t make this thread to be bashed about not using a QT system on my fish, especially after they had all been fine for so long. normally i buy all my fish from LiveAquaria or FishyBusiness Aquatics. just this summer i got my first from an lfs and it went badly. i’m not saying they are all like this, the one by my grandmas house is phenomenal and they helped me so much. YES I was stupid for not paying closer attention, and putting my current fish at risk, but mistakes happened and i learned from it.

i apologize for blaming the lfs for the sick angel, and didn’t mean to cause any misunderstandings or bashing against them.

WVNed · Oct 8, 2018

I have fish and inverts from 2 Petcos, 2 LFSs, LA east and west, DD, Liveplants.com, GARF and saltwater.com. I don't quarantine and never have.

and when I drive a car I use my skill as a driver and not luck to get me where I want to go.

jtl · Oct 8, 2018

HB AL said:
Thats not a true statement, ive been doing this for 30+ years and have never run a qaurantine tank. But i do buy all my fish from the same lfs, who obviously sell healthy specimens. Just added this clown trigger 5 days ago, float and plop.

I love that trigger. I had one 20 years ago.

brandon429 · Oct 8, 2018

My thoughts

Not one thing you listed was a coral or live rock or shrimp or crab problem, which is the bulk of reefing

Unrelenting dino invasions make anyone consider the exit

Why leave it all? Leave fish, then come back when everything goes through fallow and quarantine.

Your reef now, and the feeds that run it will be just fine on 76

Redo fishless transfer

Trust nobody, burn me once burn me twice got you to thinking about leaving, not velvet. You already know how to stop that... Only trust burned you, not procedure. We'd only leave if we had to expend this money and not have a reliable procedure to stop losing it, but we do.

Fallow and quarantine is so easy, im surprised something that takes care of the bulk of marine disease loss isn't a book of meds. It's substrate separation and removal of host, same for all imports. That you intercepted them before the store means nothing, that's not a caveat on the big fallow threads they still carried.

* Even if they didn't bring in new disease, hard to say not knowing all specifics, it was a deviation from plan of being sure.

Just remove fish, bulk on nice corals so you won't be bored till Christmas, and by then have your new additions fallowed in a different room, observing aerial transfer variables as well, then 2019 is a go. You got 80% of the game in check, the other twenty is a written order of ops not even a guess

jtl · Oct 8, 2018

I have stopped and started at least 3x. If you are sick of it give a break. I have things going pretty good right now but if I had a catastrophic problem I would be gone. Imo this hobby is too maintenance heavy. By that I mean if you are away for more than a day, maybe less, bad things can happen. We would like to travel more and that means arranging for someone to watch things but even then what can they do if something happens? I am not going to stress over it but it is a lot more complicated than taking my dog to the boarding kennel.

reeflover_3303 · Oct 8, 2018

Who uses luck to drive ????

HB AL · Oct 8, 2018

jtl said:
I love that trigger. I had one 20 years ago.

My 2nd favorite is the blueline, might try it next year, i really luve fish more so than corals and this tank was gonna be a trigger tank so i put a niger, the sargassum and bluejaw in there then just started buying coral frags of all types and before i knew it they thrived and turned into the cluster you see now. A tank like this is not for everyone.

jtl · Oct 8, 2018

HB AL said:
My 2nd favorite is the blueline, might try it next year, i really luve fish more so than corals and this tank was gonna be a trigger tank so i put a niger, the sargassum and bluejaw in there then just started buying coral frags of all types and before i knew it they thrived and turned into the cluster you see now. A tank like this is not for everyone.

How big is the tank?

HB AL · Oct 8, 2018

jtl said:
How big is the tank?

92G Cad lights with a 30g sump, nice and simple, lots of live rock, a vertex skimmer and 5 160we Kessils. I have no controllers, dosers, ato and such. I manually dose for alk, calcium and magnesium. I dose red sea colors for trace elements as i dont do water changes. I dose nopox to keep nitrates between 15-30ppm, and keep a bag of phosgaurd and kent carbon in the sump.

jtl · Oct 8, 2018

HB AL said:
92G Cad lights with a 30g sump, nice and simple, lots of live rock, a vertex skimmer and 5 160we Kessils. I have no controllers, dosers, ato and such. I manually dose for alk, calcium and magnesium. I dose red sea colors for trace elements as i dont do water changes. I dose nopox to keep nitrates between 15-30ppm, and keep a bag of phosgaurd and kent carbon in the sump.

You are doing good. I like simple. I don't use a controller or dosers but I do have a DIY ato. My current tank is a little over a year old but I have had many over 30 years. The more I learn the more I am convinced that less is better. I have a Cadlight 100 with a diy sump. My 60+ coral frags are just now taking off. I ended up buying a little more high end frags but who knows if that will pay off. Believe it or not there are over 60 frags in this tank, most of which are over a year old.

ZoWhat · Oct 8, 2018

Fill your empty tank with ice and beer and have a House Party

kennydoll · Oct 8, 2018

i’ve made a decision. i’ll keep the healthy fish. i’ll leave the 125 fallow until after christmas. i’ve been pondering and that’s what i’ve officially decided. however. we will see if i decide to keep all of the fish, or if i find homes for some of them. i’ll just stick with inverts and corals for this tank until it’s ready for fish again

brandon429 · Oct 8, 2018

I don't even keep fish so its not hard for me to sell the concept...I just like coral
I know for most people with a reef that weighs more than fifteen pounds all up running they'd want fish and I would too (weight of a reef tank with a 6 inch diameter is approx. fifteen pounds rocks plus water lol)

so glad freshwater keeping isn't like this or I really would be mad/understand your concern.

for freshwater, buying from good lfs and putting in a good home is good enough ive been lucky a long time. Paul B talks about being disease free in his marine tank which uses lots of natural substrates and natural seawater, he doesnt fallow like the rest and his tank is likely diverse enough to work aside that

but for the rest, including my local friends, they had to fallow and follow normal procedure then all their marine fish and tanks were in harmony and not any abnormal losses

marine fish require interesting protocols and self control ive learned from humblefish threads... never leave the hobby altogether, always have at least a pico they wont let you down unless you elbow them off the cabinet accidentally.

fredk · Oct 8, 2018

reeflover_3303 said:
Who uses luck to drive ????

The guy who drinks a quart of whisky and then decides to go for a drive hitting you head on.

We have seatbelts, airbags and crumple zones to protect us from accidents.

I see quarantine the same way. The OP had bad luck. Quarantine would have mitigated that.

To the OP. Is there any way you can set up a temporary quarantine somewhere and store it out of the way when it is not needed? Living in an apartment I have a space issue. I have found a spot in my bedroom where I can at least run a tank for a month or two at a go if I need a quarantine tank.

vetteguy53081 · Oct 8, 2018

I had two disasters in the form of major tank leaks with two different tank and endured total losses and feel for what is on your agenda for taking a break ,,,,,,HOWEVER I used my loss as a method of restructuring and replanning and making the next tank even better yet. Think about this before you pull out completely. iwas going to be DA*N if I was going to let a losss kick me in the butt. Now I cant count the number of people who visit me and ask to take pics and show their co-workers and family. It's a proud feeling of accomplishment

cancun · Oct 8, 2018

kennydoll said:
the recent sick fish who wiped out my tank again had nothing to do with the lfs. i understand that. and maybe it’s “irresponsible” but i know tons of people who keep fish with a quarantine system. and believe it or not, i work at a pet store, inthe aquatics department where i specialize in the keeping of freshwater and marine fish. i have kept fish with no problems for almost two years, until this summer when my fish all got velvet. and it’s only in this tank. my 20 gallon? PERFECT. my 55 gallon? PERFECT. my 125, where i do water changes every week, and don’t add a fish in unless i know it’s compatible with the ones i already have, still manages to end up with problems. and it wasn’t a problem until i got that naso. the pet store where i work, isn’t allowed to dose copper in their systems. in fact, i know two other LFS, both who’ve been out of business, who didn’t dose copper either. my 55 gallon tank only has all the fish i listed that are healthy right now and i’ll say that the quality of water is perfect and fish are perfect. i devote so much time and money and research into these tanks because it’s what has made me happy for so long.

the naso tang, who was the first to get sick, yes that may have been my fault for not quarantining but he was rather large, and would be extra stressed in my 20 gallon QT, wouldn’t he? and keep in mind, this is the same lfs that has mischarged me on multiple occasions. i understand completely that it’s a learning experience, i understand completely that it’s hard and sometimes our mistakes is what makes the project turn out the best in the end. but i didn’t make this thread to be bashed about not using a QT system on my fish, especially after they had all been fine for so long. normally i buy all my fish from LiveAquaria or FishyBusiness Aquatics. just this summer i got my first from an lfs and it went badly. i’m not saying they are all like this, the one by my grandmas house is phenomenal and they helped me so much. YES I was stupid for not paying closer attention, and putting my current fish at risk, but mistakes happened and i learned from it.

i apologize for blaming the lfs for the sick angel, and didn’t mean to cause any misunderstandings or bashing against them.

I was following this post and thought I'd chime in. I am really sorry for what happened with your fish and tank! I agree no one should be bashing you at all. You know the old sang "let he who casts the first stone be without sin".

There are pros and cons to QT. I don't QT eaither, that is my choice. I accept the risk. Plenty of people loose fish in QT as well. Whether to QT or not is a personal choice, up to each individual Aquarist. I don't judge anyone in this hobby. I know the OP didn't come on here to be judged.

My advice is if you love the hobby, and it sounds like you do....than I would stick with it.... maybe take a break from your bigger tank and devote your time and effort to your other tanks that are thriving. I have had ups and downs too, and lost plenty of money in the past too. So I get it. But when things thrive it is do worth it! Hang in there and keep us posted!

By the way, I would love to see pics of your thriving smaller tanks! [emoji16]