This hobby has beaten and broke me down.

[melypr1985]

The issue then becomes why is it so bad and why have the exhibited spots for weeks now?

I looks so bad after weeks, because they have spent those weeks multiplying in numbers that boggle the mind (mine at least). Now there are so many that it's pretty bad looking I'm guessing.

 

[stevo01]

Will going through another copper treatment so soon decrease survive rate?

 

[stevo01]

In reference to copper toxicity not the ich.

 

[melypr1985]

Will going through another copper treatment so soon decrease survive rate?

In reference to copper toxicity not the ich.

Are we talking about survival of the fish? No, they would most likely be fine (assuming they don't die from the parasites of course). I've kept fish in Coppersafe for a full year at the store with no problems. One was a marine betta and another was a huge box puffer (those are just the two I can think of off the top of my head).

Edit to say: not all fish would be fine with prolonged exposure of course and it's not recommended at all. Sometimes it's needed though when a situation such as this arises.

 

[Humblefish]

I'll just say this... Sometimes you gotta bite the bullet and hit the reset button on your tank. I recommend going fallow for 76 days, and treating all your fish in a QT.

I would assume the worst and follow this protocol: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/velvet-amyloodinium-ocellatum.217570/#post-2499437

The FW dip + chemical bath + 1 month in copper will eradicate all external parasites. You would just need to deworm with Prazipro afterwards.

 

[4FordFamily]

I would think so. I have seen a couple (out of hundreds) of reports of fish that developed a short term immunity from velvet. They eventually died from it, but they looked pretty bad off and on for awhile before that happened. Sometimes they don't look bad at all and only the new fish die from it. Of course, these people were not using a QT. I would lean toward ick given the data in this thread.

Fish that have been in ich management tanks for years and that are obviously very established to captivity can survive several weeks as I learned with my worst out of velvet I always talk about that killed angels. I had a hippo tang and several wrasse that made it for 5-6 weeks before I knew what it was and what was going on. That was the quarantine trigger for me personally.

New angels dropped in 2-7 days with 3-4 bring average. I kept thinking I "solved" the problem but I had never been exposed to velvet of this caliber and type after killing 4-5 angels, a tusk, and a couple tangs I figured it out

 

[4FordFamily]

The issue then becomes why is it so bad and why have the exhibited spots for weeks now?

Don't take me wrong, but the other question is why have they had spots for weeks? When I see them for a couple days I know it's time to act.

Sorry you're struggling I was there, I was a real hard head and caused myself a lot of stress and looking back I really acted like a raging moron. But you live and learn!

 

[4FordFamily]

I can also tell you from experience that 8 weeks does not work for ich. Also if you add fish to an existing qt you need to restart the clock. I personally don't believe ich is taken out in 4 weeks or 30 days in qt, anyway. I treat for 45 from last addition I assume all additions have ich, velvet, and flukes. In today's environment that's not really that outlandish of an assumption.

 

[Brew12]

I was a real hard head and caused myself a lot of stress and looking back I really acted like a raging moron. But you live and learn!

At least you weren't as bad as the guy who wrote this article!

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/ich-and-acanthurus-tangs-years-of-experience-and-ich-management.106/

Oh.. wait!

 

[4FordFamily]

At least you weren't as bad as the guy who wrote this article!

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/ich-and-acanthurus-tangs-years-of-experience-and-ich-management.106/

Oh.. wait!

Yeah in need to edit the snot out of that and turn it from a forum post to an article better but I hardly have time to sleep anymore so it will have to look like a jerk 12 year old wrote it for a bit

Yeah I'm not proud of those days at all.

 

[TheEngineer]

Treating fish is amazingly frustrating to me too. I had a group of Vanderbilt chromis in QT, which ultimately died from me being an idiot, for 2 months. They got velvet, treated the velvet with @Humblefish's guide using FW dips, Rally and copper. They came through that and looked great actually. They went right into prazi, but turned out to have internal parasites and I lost one to it. It's an awful feeling to expend so much effort only to fail.

That said, you are doing the right thing by QT'ing them. You are doing the right thing by going fallow in your DT. This short term frustration will pay off with long term gains. I only have one fish in my DT right now, but she's been with me for 7 years. I won't risk getting her sick and I want these other fish to be with me for just as long. Giving them a healthy start is the only way to do it.

Stick with it! Post up here a lot about what's going on. It really helps to have people cheering you on and supporting you. @melypr1985 and @Brew12 were in my corner the whole time and it made a big difference for me.

 

[Brew12]

Yeah in need to edit the snot out of that and turn it from a forum post to an article better but I hardly have time to sleep anymore so it will have to look like a jerk 12 year old wrote it for a bit

Yeah I'm not proud of those days at all.

I'm just glad that you took the time to share it. I know that as someone new to reefing it made a very large impression on me. In fact, it is the first article I read on R2R and was got me to start paying so much attention to the fish disease section of the forums. But.... I've hijacked this thread enough.

 

[4FordFamily]

I'm just glad that you took the time to share it. I know that as someone new to reefing it made a very large impression on me. In fact, it is the first article I read on R2R and was got me to start paying so much attention to the fish disease section of the forums. But.... I've hijacked this thread enough.

I'm glad it had an impact. I cannot undo what I did but if I can save people from doing as I did and I help save other fish I can at least try.

Thank you for telling me that, it means more than you know.

 

[Breakthecycle2]

So, for the third time since August of 2015, I bit the bullet again and took the tank apart. 4 hours later, new sand and great new aqua scape, I got all the fish out and in QT. I lost my maculiceps tang this morning. Two of the fish in one of the QT tanks don't look so good. Disease, stress or both, I'm not sure...although one is a Leopard wrasse and has no I Sibley symptoms of anything. The other, like last time is my tusk. My last tusk died because of whatever was in the tank thrn, most likely velvet.

 

[Breakthecycle2]

This is sad man . I read all your threads back to august when your problem was first identified. I agree with cross contamination. How is the black tang doing?

He seems to be hanging in there. stressed because of the move back to QT.

 

[Breakthecycle2]

Don't take me wrong, but the other question is why have they had spots for weeks? When I see them for a couple days I know it's time to act.

I've been sick with pneumonia and then with Thanksgiving I didn't have the time. I was also hoping to use ICH management. When I thought it might be more the ICH, I started contemplating my options, including selling everything off.

 

[Breakthecycle2]

Futhermore, this is my last go round. I don't have it in me to keep doing this. I guess I did cross centimeters somehow, that's really the only way I could have had velvet again. If it was

 

[4FordFamily]

Futhermore, this is my last go round. I don't have it in me to keep doing this. I guess I did cross centimeters somehow, that's really the only way I could have had velvet again. If it was

My best advice to you is to take things very very slow. I know it's hard I'm the least patient person on earth. Buy a few fish at a time, qt, treat full term with one medication at a time, then remove meds and observe 30 days before adding.

My arm, nets, magnets, water siphons and hose, splash back in to my mixed fish food, etc. have all caused cross contamination in my tanks in the past year. I too am very busy and mentally idle half the time so I made stupid mistakes.

It happens. Ich management is nearly impossible to utilize these days with stronger strains of parasites and velvet so prevalent. If you're buying a lot of fish you're absoslutely going to get exposed to everything in the book.

Add the fact that you and I like to keep expensive and difficult to keep fish, ich management never worked for these fish by and large.

Good luck, take it slow and you'll be OK

 

[stevo01]

My best advice to you is to take things very very slow. I know it's hard I'm the least patient person on earth. Buy a few fish at a time, qt, treat full term with one medication at a time, then remove meds and observe 30 days before adding.

My arm, nets, magnets, water siphons and hose, splash back in to my mixed fish food, etc. have all caused cross contamination in my tanks in the past year. I too am very busy and mentally idle half the time so I made stupid mistakes.

It happens. Ich management is nearly impossible to utilize these days with stronger strains of parasites and velvet so prevalent. If you're buying a lot of fish you're absoslutely going to get exposed to everything in the book.

Add the fact that you and I like to keep expensive and difficult to keep fish, ich management never worked for these fish by and large.

Good luck, take it slow and you'll be OK

Great post man!

 

[stevo01]

Futhermore, this is my last go round. I don't have it in me to keep doing this. I guess I did cross centimeters somehow, that's really the only way I could have had velvet again. If it was