Warning: Use Vibrant at your own risk

[MnFish1]

Lets say you and a friend go to a restaurant and get 100% angus burgers. Your friend gets food poisoning, but yours is literally the best burger you've had, doesn't matter to you it made your friend sick, you're full and happy. Well, then an expose comes out that you in fact ate dog meat, as that is what the restaurant was serving. Like I said, it's the best burger you've had, are you still happy to go eat at that place again and eat the meal that was great for you but made your friend sick, even when they lied about its contents? You don't care that you were told it was beef because it was a delicious meal that filled you up?

Beyond the numerous problems this additive has caused peoples tanks, the bold faced lying and false advertising is mostly what people are upset/frustrated with.

On the surface, this is a good argument. I do not think it is a good comparison though. Lets say you took 10 friends to a restaurant for Kobe beef. 9/10 friends LOVED the beef. 1 person got sick - and it was later found out that instead of Kobe beef - it was Grade B meat. So - 9/10 people overpaid - but were happy. One person overpaid and got sick.

IMHO - vibrant has worked for numerous people. If the company mislabeled it deliberately or by accident - that is NOT ACCEPTABLE - if it caused coral loss or tank damage. So - This is not a defense of potential business practices. But - people are acting like this is rat poison. In fact - we use it in our pool every spring and fall.

As to the discussion - what if my kids drank it. Well first of all - I wouldn't want my kids to drink microbacter 7 either. Or a bottle of manganese - or multiple other chemicals people dose into their tanks.

None of this is to excuse the manufacturer - depending on the results. And none of this is to dissuade people from reading the warning at the top of the thread.

 

[MnFish1]

So... You'll continue to use a product from a company that lied to you about what it was when you can buy the same exact thing for less money from another company that was honest about what it is?

Here is a question. Do you own a Ford car (wasn't the allegation they lied about the pinto), a Chevrolet (allegation about problem with I think the Corsair), Toyota or one of the many companies that allegedly minimized air bag problems? I mean IDK - when I personally read from someone 'I'm dosing xxx'. - I say hmmm my tank is all good - I'm not doing that.

EDIT - BTW - there is no independent evidence that anyone 'lied'. BUT - I totally agree with the BRS video - there should be independent accurate blinded testing. After that comes out - and Like Randy - my guess is there is going to be a polyquat compound present - if so the company should perhaps try to figure out 'why', and adjust their labeling and apologize.

 

[happyhourhero]

Fanboys gunna fanboy. These days, no matter what, people will stick to their tribe because they can do no wrong.

 

[MnFish1]

Fanboys gunna fanboy. These days, no matter what, people will stick to their tribe because they can do no wrong.

its best if you refer to the quote you're referring to. I'm no fanboy of vibrant (marine). If you mean my quote - quote it - and discuss it - rather than using those buzzwords like fanboy, etc

 

[jda]

Boyd got crushed publicly in the early internet days for being liars too - anybody in the hobby long enough and on the internet remembers this. I have no idea about the EPA side the Boyd deal. Boyd was the first instance that convinced me, at least, to NEVER give any of these companies the benefit of the doubt or try and defend them - once a liar, always a liar, at least in this hobby. Nobody has ever found redemption and started to be honest after being found out... at least that I can remember. People found public records and orders of erythromycin going to them and everything. I know many people that buy the competitive product if they need to use something like that.... it is cheaper and they have not lied.

I don't even want to mention them or make the false equivalencies, really, since it sounds like an excuse to let others be liars too. Integrity and honesty should always be the goal, regardless of who is not.

 

[elysics]

As to the discussion - what if my kids drank it. Well first of all - I wouldn't want my kids to drink microbacter 7 either. Or a bottle of manganese - or multiple other chemicals people dose into their tanks.

That's not what that argument is about, it's about what comes after. Once you are sitting in the emergency room and the doctors ask what happened. "my son drank a bottle of bacteria" is going to get a very different reaction from "my son drank a pesticide", where the docotrs could look that pesticide up and what the recommended procedures are. They probably wouldn't give you the antibiotics you'd get when you say he swallowed bacteria.

 

[happyhourhero]

its best if you refer to the quote you're referring to. I'm no fanboy of vibrant (marine). If you mean my quote - quote it - and discuss it - rather than using those buzzwords like fanboy, etc

It was in reference to multiple folks in the thread that don’t seem to care about deception. Apologies for not quoting each one.

 

[MnFish1]

That's not what that argument is about, it's about what comes after. Once you are sitting in the emergency room and the doctors ask what happened. "my son drank a bottle of bacteria" is going to get a very different reaction from "my son drank a pesticide", where the docotrs could look that pesticide up and what the recommended procedures are. They probably wouldn't give you the antibiotics you'd get when you say he swallowed bacteria.

Right - I literally almost called a poison information center - but thought it was a waste of resources. I think you're overdramatizing it. There are poisonous 'pesticides' and there are 'non-poisoned pesticides'). There are damaging bacteria - there are non-damaging bacteria. One argument that makes sense to me - is that - if the bacteria are not listed on the label - who knows what they did or didn't drink? Same with an algaecide - right?

 

[MnFish1]

It was in reference to multiple folks in the thread that don’t seem to care about deception. Apologies for not quoting each one.

IMHO - everyone on this thread cares about deception.

EDIT - AND BTW - neither is appropriate. If there is an algaecide - it should be listed - if there are bacteria - they should be listed. For example there are immunosuppressed people - that if a normally non-toxic bacteria was swallowed - could be a problem

 

[jda]

It is always overdramatizing until it is your family member, your kid, your dog, your cat or your tank that is damaged. Up until then, people can be somewhat flippant, with the "calm down," or "this stuff is safe to be used for XXX" or "you should not use this kind of stuff anyway." Too few can see what can happen while it is still abstract for them.

 

[MnFish1]

It is always overdramatizing until it is your family member, your kid, your dog, your cat or your tank that is damaged. Up until then, people can be somewhat flippant, with the "calm down," or "this stuff is safe to be used for XXX" or "you should use this kind of stuff anyway." Too few can see what can happen while it is still abstract for them.

Oh come on. You know what I meant. BTW - any parent that would let their kid BE ABLE to drink ANY aquarium additive - is a bad parent - which of course doesnt help the child. No one is being flippant. You seem to have an axe to grind. Keep grinding it. I said - plainly - and I'll say it again - If the labeling on Vibrant is wrong - it should be corrected. The evidence suggests that there is a polyquat compound in vibrant at some concentration. Testing is 'in progress'. But - here is a question - do you know of any family (adult) or child - that has been damaged by vibrant? If not - you're just making up a story that has a good ring to it IMHO - The labeling should be correct - YOU"RE RIGHT.

 

[elysics]

Right - I literally almost called a poison information center - but thought it was a waste of resources. I think you're overdramatizing it. There are poisonous 'pesticides' and there are 'non-poisoned pesticides'). There are damaging bacteria - there are non-damaging bacteria. One argument that makes sense to me - is that - if the bacteria are not listed on the label - who knows what they did or didn't drink? Same with an algaecide - right?

Calling the poison control center when you or someone in your family swallowed something and you are not sure if it's safe, is never a waste of resources.

Figuring out whether anything needs to be done or not is what those resources are for. To prevent someone thinking it's probably safe when it wasn't.

Nothing to overdramatize here.

With bacteria. it's not so much an issue. Antibiotics either way, if push comes to shove then trying out a couple different ones. The field of pesticides is very wide with very different treatments.

 

[MnFish1]

Calling the poison control center when you or someone in your family swallowed something and you are not sure if it's safe, is never a waste of resources.

Figuring out whether anything needs to be done or not is what those resources are for. To prevent someone thinking it's probably safe when it wasn't.

Nothing to overdramatize here.

With bacteria. it's not so much an issue. Antibiotics either way, if push comes to shove then trying out a couple different ones. The field of pesticides is very wide with very different treatments.

The last paragraph is patently untrue. For example - immunosuppressed people should not take 'probiotics'' that are for normal people 'safe'. Thus - IMHO - a company manufacturing a bacterial product - should list the bacterial species - how many do? FEW.

The poison control issue - was (thought it was clear) - I thought about calling poison control 0- to ask if they had information on vibrant. Obviously - I did not have a child with a problem - so - in my example - a waste of resources. If parent xxx called a poison control center saying they drank algaefix/vibrant/rubdinium/mangansese - they would call the manufacturer - and they would be given the answer.

 

[jda]

Leave out the stuff before the ...but, the label should be correct. Nothing before the "but" counts right? If I have an axe to grind, then you are complicit as a low-key apologist for trying to sow even the slightest doubt that what has happened is wrong by questioning any consequences, even if hypothetical. I don't even know that you know that you are doing it.

It should just be said that it is wrong and the label should be correct - period. Nothing else needs to be said before or after this in any context. It just looks like excuses for UWC, even if you put a "but is should have a correct label" at the end of it.

 

[MnFish1]

Leave out the stuff before the ...but, the label should be correct. Nothing before the "but" counts right? If I have an axe to grind, then you are complicit as a low-key apologist for trying to sow even the slightest doubt that what has happened is wrong by questioning any consequences, even if hypothetical. I don't even know that you know that you are doing it.

It should just be said that it is wrong and the label should be correct - period. Nothing else needs to be said before or after this in any context. It just looks like excuses for UWC, even if you put a "but is should have a correct label" at the end of it.

Yea - if you're paying attention to TV shows. What I said was true - before and after the but

 

[BrianAnthony]

Everything about Vibrant is a marketing ploy. The label and the dark blue bottle suggest that bacteria is IN the bottle. Period. Why dark blue?? A filter for U/V light. U/V kills bacteria. The other ingredients listed on the label are for bacteria sustainability.

If it's an algaecide inside.. the label and marketing are flat out lies. No buts.. No excuses.. No Mercy for deliberate deception.

 

[Jeffcb]

So I have a little hair algae in my Reefer 250 reef tank and I'm not going to read 32 pages lol.

Should I use it or not?

 

[Garf]

So I have a little hair algae in my Reefer 250 reef tank and I'm not going to read 32 pages lol.

Should I use it or not?

Buy an urchin, they contain 100% urchin, lol

 

[BoneDoc]

I dosed Vibrant for my bubble algae infestation and it worked after a month. But I’m glad I have not tried it in my 180

 

[jp_75]

I have used Vibrant while ago for bubble algea. It did what it should but after that i am battling other types( hair, cyano) … I only used it 3 or maybe 4 times.