Be taken seriously!! Post those tanks!!

saltyfilmfolks · Jan 25, 2016

Marquiseo said:

Ahahahahahahaha

Duke4Life · Jan 25, 2016

Lionfish Lair · Jan 25, 2016

timkenagy said:
And there's always at least one to stand at the sideline and mock. Even when you heard them the first time...

Take a joke...... If you post such strong opinions, you better be able to take more than a friendly joke.

saltyfilmfolks · Jan 25, 2016

Marquiseo said:
Also, I don't think my pics are that great. I can still see improvements needed in all photos I take. I am still learning but I can back what I state with all the data needed. I don't give advice on subjects I don't know anything about to avoid debates and making myself look like a(n) ...

Ya take good pics. Trust me I'm an expert.
And we all shoot off or mouths
I can prove that in this post

Marquiseo · Jan 25, 2016

hybridazn said:
I know what point you are trying to get across, and for some parts I totally agree. Where we disagree is the "your display needs to be top notch to justify any advice you give as credible to me." You titled the thread be taken seriously, post your tanks. Not sure how that's even credible. As stated before any person can have a insane full blown sps tank in their home they can post pics of, but in reality it's taken care of by others. So the having a successful tank argument isn't going great anywhere.

In other words, you could have gotten your point across by wording it different. Your thread title and your OP are basically saying that unless you have a nice tank your advice isn't good here.

I think he means to say "show that you know what you are talking about". If a person is stating that they have the cure for nuisance algae, they should be able to show their tank without any algae and the same thing months later. A hobbyist should be able to follow their build for future advice and strive to emulate their success.

I do, however, disagree that a grown out reef tank = expert reefer as you stated. I, also, don't believe that just because a person been in this hobby long, they are automatically experts. There is a saying that " you can't teach an old dog new tricks". This hobby is constantly evolving and some people don't like change while often refusing to advance for the better.

saltyfilmfolks · Jan 25, 2016

o2manyfish said:
I want to thank the people that took offense to my post and posted to defend their knowledge and experience.

I'm going to point the finger at twillard... Maybe twillard is a great guy, maybe he spends hours of day helping people on forums, maybe he as a garage of aquariums that have been thriving for 20 years, and maybe he doesn't share all that. But this is what I see him share...

"But what if I grow bryopsis to find a meaningful solution to it besides the common (nutrients are too high)?
I dont have valued information because you will see it in my tank even though I put it there?"

Your first foray into the hobby and you want to become a Bryopsis expert...

Your going to experiment to find a meaningful solution for Bryopsis...

And you post a swamp of an aquarium....

Did you have a beautiful and successful longterm aquarium, that one day Bryopsis took over and destroyed? Show me the successful tank, show me what Bryopsis did to it, show me what you did to try to resolve the problem.

And now you declare your position in the hobby is to find a meaningful bryopsis solution. You show 1 tank, and you can't even see that bryopsis is flourishing in that tank. A meaningful solution is going to be found by having a quantity of identical tanks, with identical situations, and varying the variable on a few tanks while maintaining multiple control tanks.

You could put a television in front of your Bryopsis tank, run Seinfeld 24/7, and when the Bryopsis starts to die off - You now have a Bryopsis solution... And given you enthusiasm for your Bryopsis project, your might go out right away and start posting on every Bryoposis thread that Seinfeld will fix it.

In my opinion it's these kinds of limited experiences and knowledge that people seeking help should stop and question as to who is giving them advice and why they should listen to it.

And just cause you have done something once, doesn't mean you did it correctly or right, and should necessarily take on the teacher roll for those with less knowledge than your own.

Now I also realize that posting in forums the intent, personality, and humor that we wish to write with cannot always be seen. And maybe Twillard was posting that tank as joke, and we were all suppose to laugh, drink some beer, and post a smiley face emojicon. I use Twillard as the example, because it was there, I have nothing personal against Twillard, I do not know his history, I don't know what he has posted in the past.

And as can be seen even in this thread, there are people out their, with the best intentions, helping people who don't have the experience or knowledge to do so, but posting with such high opinions of themselves they don't see how they are misguiding those that need help, and they clearly don't understand the original intention of this thread and that it applies to them.

Dave B

It would be great if you hung out and shared your knowledge. humble fish and Robert go at it like big cats and as an observer you can really learn a lot. And as its a healthy heated debate they actually learn a lot too.

saltyfilmfolks · Jan 25, 2016

Lionfish Lair said:
People do stupid stuff based on people's stupid advice all the time everywhere. That's life. You help who you can, but sometimes ya gotta let some go...... sometimes people don't listen to their own common sense, let alone someone else's.

OR, you can show them your tank thread and then they have to listen to you... I kid... I kid.

I do stupid stuff based on my own advice.

saltyfilmfolks · Jan 25, 2016

Marquiseo said:
I think he means to say "show that you know what you are talking about". If a person is stating that they have the cure for nuisance algae, they should be able to show their tank without any algae and the same thing months later. A hobbyist should be able to follow their build for future advice and strive to emulate their success.

I do, however, disagree that a grown out reef tank = expert reefer as you stated. I, also, don't believe that just because a person been in this hobby long, they are automatically experts. There is a saying that " you can't teach an old dog new tricks". This hobby is constantly evolving and some people don't like change while often refusing to advance for the better.

I do know a guy with national writ ups for his SPS tank nuked his Zoas and softies and didn't know why. Just sayin.

timkenagy · Jan 25, 2016

Lionfish Lair said:
Take a joke...... If you post such strong opinions, you better be able to take more than a friendly joke.

Oh I was just "joking" as well

brandon429 · Jan 25, 2016

The basic premise for everything I've ever posted is: since corals grow in a fishbowl that makes them not exclusive domain anymore for just cool ubertechs like 1998
Ergo, you should blast clean that disgusting sandbed and cheat your system clean by oxidizer and here's two thousand people who did. I'm not saying that's agreeable or accurate just that it's truly my basis for all of it. That's my entire hand, laid out.

saltyfilmfolks · Jan 25, 2016

If anyone else here is Into social anthropology. Chimps do this too.

Bryce Peterson · Jan 25, 2016

I'm a newbie to reefkeeping. My tank is less than a year old and I'm still working out the kinks. That doesn't mean I can't share my experiences with people. Your tank may look like an acroporic utopia, but that doesn't mean I don't know anything. While I appreciate the pictures of stunning designer corals, I'm not a coral gardener. My goal is to create an ecosystem that represents my idea of a natural undersea environment. That visual may not impress some people. I strive to speak only to what I know based on personal experience and the first year in this hobby is just full of experiences

. I don't need an impressive sps reef to advise someone not to use tap water, or that adding an rbta on week 4 might not turn out well. That was my experience, anyway.

Sabellafella · Jan 25, 2016

trido said:
This is one of the biggest reason that a lot of us old timers dont post on the forums. Its not worth the argument from someone with only a small amount of experience. Just last week I had someone post in two different responses that I didnt know what I was talking about regarding a 90G tank that was having success but was not perfect. Thier LPS were doing ok but there SPS were dying. I suggested more flow. The person responded "they have two pumps in the tank. That is plenty".
IMO, it was not and after the two responses I took it behind the scenes and asked for evidence of credibility. After all, I have 10 years of great success with SPS. I was still never given any other than a simple, I know what I'm talking about, just take my word for it".

Anyhow, Here is my current tank . Taken a month ago on Christmas eve.
Also if you want to see some of my successes. Check out my Tank of the Month thread. It has a pretty good history of my successes from the last decade.

Another person to talk about me geese get a life

Sabellafella · Jan 25, 2016

Sabellafella said:
Another person to talk about me geese get a life

This kid got madd because i said the kid has 2 powerheads in his tank flow shouldnt be a problem, nothing else that is it. Asking me if i have "photo of the month Nd do i travel with clubs and how many tanks have i had in the last decade" you take this to seriously bro what is this a game THIS IS A FORUM , i gotta come here to prove myself to people seriously man. Really pathetic bro grow up (edit i never once said you did not no what your talking about. I never even said anything to you untill you messaged me . You took it upon yourself to say (imdone withthis thread) all from me saying the kid has 2 powerheads. These people like you just take stuff offensively and dont kno how to control themselves

Sabellafella · Jan 25, 2016

To some people Its really sad that me and others have to meet a criteria to be active on a forum. This is the exact reason why i quit forums 6 years ago then came to r2r last year, sat back and enjoyed the crowd and team before i started posting

timkenagy · Jan 25, 2016

You guys can't be missing the point this badly!

hybridazn said:
I know what point you are trying to get across, and for some parts I totally agree. Where we disagree is the "your display needs to be top notch to justify any advice you give as credible to me." You titled the thread be taken seriously, post your tanks. Not sure how that's even credible. As stated before any person can have a insane full blown sps tank in their home they can post pics of, but in reality it's taken care of by others. So the having a successful tank argument isn't going great anywhere.

In other words, you could have gotten your point across by wording it different. Your thread title and your OP are basically saying that unless you have a nice tank your advice isn't good here.

I never once said your display had to be "top notch".. Actually I trust people that don't have the perfect display in there thread. I have imperfections and I do my best not to hide them. But you should have some sort of record of you experience right? Not once did I say a full blown SPS tank! I don't have even close to what you're describing! And the op basically said "that unless you have a nice tank your advice isn't good here." I never said that either! You saying I did doesn't make it so. I was asking for anyone to not give advice on the things they're not qualified to give advice on.

So basically you agree with everything I said except for the things I never said?

Bryce Peterson said:
I'm a newbie to reefkeeping. My tank is less than a year old and I'm still working out the kinks. That doesn't mean I can't share my experiences with people. Your tank may look like an acroporic utopia, but that doesn't mean I don't know anything. While I appreciate the pictures of stunning designer corals, I'm not a coral gardener. My goal is to create an ecosystem that represents my idea of a natural undersea environment. That visual may not impress some people. I strive to speak only to what I know based on personal experience and the first year in this hobby is just full of experiences . I don't need an impressive sps reef to advise someone not to use tap water, or that adding an rbta on week 4 might not turn out well. That was my experience, anyway.

Bryce, welcome to the hobby. You too have missed my point badly. Of course you can give advice not using tap water. Or putting a BTA in a new tank. I'm talking about things you've had no experience in but pretending you do. I've been doing this for about ten years. I've had 2 lions. I've tried the methods to get them to eat frozen but never had success.. Therefore I'm NOT qualified to give advice on how to successfully train a lion fish to eat frozen food. You'd be surprised how many people only a year into the hobby would argue with Sanjay Joshi (without knowing who he is) about the importance of 425nm through 475nm in the color spectrum for SPS coral growth.. When in all reality they probably just copied it from an article from Sanjay to begin with (or copied it from someone that copied it from) ... And even that's not that bothersome, because they usually make themselves look foolish in the end. It's when I see livestock at risk. Money down the drain and people give up.. Just because someone wants to look like the smartest guy in the room. If you haven't started a tank thread I encourage you to do so. It's not about who has better and what is prettier. Heck I have a moderately successful 180 gallon reef tank. And I spend just as much if not more time staring into my refugium and frag tank in the basement. (Plus having a tank thread is a basic requirement for most contests and giveaways here anyway

)

rayn · Jan 25, 2016

Here is what i have learned along the way of keeping tanks, reefs or otherwise. Each tank is different, noob couple years old, or PaulB 44 years old. No two tanks are alike. Just because I start a 150 and you start a 150 and we buy the exact same equipment, which never happens, doesn't mean we have the same end results. As the tank goes along and matures, each of us run into difficulties we need to overcome. From detrius issues, ich, supplements, whatever. There are always multiple ways to solve each problem with no one set in stone way.

The people trying new things, be it fish or coral or solving a problem, are the ones making it better. Just because their solution worked doesn't make them a expert, but it gives another solution. If as was said earlier, Seinfeld solves bryopsis then I will put Seinfeld on in front of my tank. But just fuse it works for one doesn't mean it works for all. Just because TTM has become the new way to treat for ich, doesn't mean I am using that method. I've done hypo and copper and still like copper. My personal choice. Never done TTM, so I wmnt comment on how to.

Now as far as build threads, sure they show what one can do, but isn't proof to me that it is successful long term...again except PaulB.

Honestly it doesn't matter to me how long anyone hasbeen in the hobby. Once they set their tank up and have it running, they have their experience to share. Maybe it's good, maybe it's bad, but they have to share for anyone to know or help.

Point is, I tbought we were all here to help. I've been on other forums and left because posts became fights about who or what was right. I've been on other forums and still am that are just there to help. R2R is a great resource for the noon to the experienced reefer, let's keep it that way

cb684 · Jan 25, 2016

This hobby taught me patience. This forum is teaching me to choose my battles.
I often see myself writing a comment, just to delete it afterwards. I guess usually I enter discussions when I think the advice given may cause harm, or if I am interested in a point of view and want more information.
This thread is interesting. And it is putting to discussion what would make an advice more reliable.
In other (non-hobby) situations we use CVs and Recommendation Letters. We also interview candidates before adding them to the team.
I guess it would be interesting to know what makes somebody reliable for different people.

-# of posts
-# of years in the hobby
-# of years in the forum
-if they are part of special groups (Reef Squad, R2 Excellence Award, ...)
-pictures of their tanks (or build threads)
-knowing their background (for example Randy being a chemist)
-knowing the system they run
-giving the answer you expected